Bitcoin - Part 2

[Andy_Ross]

How easy is cashing out?

 

[Eddie Dane]

I, for one, will definitely admit to kicking myself now.

So am I.

I looked into it a bit. I could easily have given it a spin with very little risk.
Now I'd be spending real money investing a real bubble. Even if the Tech is going to make it, this is still a speculative bubble.

And that bubble may ride all the way to the hundreds of thousands per Bitcoin. Who the hell knows?

I'm no professional investor but seems that this whole thing is devoid of any context, in that there is no real-world indicator of intrinsic value. Just the hopes and dreams of the investors and prospective investors.


So, the only way to estimate the possible value of Bitcoin is looking at the reservoir of prospective buyers. And at this point, not many people are invested and it is going totally mainstream with 20-year-old Bitcoin millionaires being interviewed on prime-time TV and articles on the front pages of the biggest news sites.

Uber drivers are telling you to buy Bitcoin, usually the sign to cut and run. And yet, this may only be the beginning.

 

[Eddie Dane]

https://www.theguardian.com/technol...u-plan-cryptocurrency-price-traders-anonymity

The UK and other EU governments are planning a crackdown on bitcoin amid growing concerns that the digital currency is being used for money laundering and tax evasion.

The Treasury plans to regulate bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies to bring them in line with anti-money laundering and counter-terrorism financial legislation. Traders will be forced to disclose their identities, ending the anonymity that has made the currency attractive for drug dealing and other illegal activities.

Under the EU-wide plan, online platforms where bitcoins are traded will be required to carry out due diligence on customers and report suspicious transactions.

 

[Belz...]

And just a few days after $10,000 it is now at $11,500.

Amazing.

Imagine, just a few years ago you could have bought just 1 bitcoin at $100 and now cash out at $11,500.

Only if you had waited this long. You probably would've cashed out at 200 or something. And there's no guarantee that you can get rid of your BTC.

 

[psionl0]

I'm no professional investor but seems that this whole thing is devoid of any context, in that there is no real-world indicator of intrinsic value. Just the hopes and dreams of the investors and prospective investors.

Isn't that the case with all forms of investment? Even investments that result in "real" things being produced (eg farms) require people with financial nous to make it happen.

https://www.theguardian.com/technol...u-plan-cryptocurrency-price-traders-anonymity

The "war on drugs" tells us exactly how this will pan out. A lot of innocent speculators will be trapped by the new laws while the Mr Bigs of the crypto world will continue their nefarious activities without the slightest pause.

 

[This is The End]

How easy is cashing out?

Pretty easy to cash out a few thousand $. Cashing out a few hundred thousand $ is going to be tricky and you're going to be giving someone a big cut to get it done.

I, for one, will definitely admit to kicking myself now.

Oh for sure. I would love a time machine. Reading the first thread is pretty funny right now.

Only if you had waited this long. You probably would've cashed out at 200 or something.

You know me too well. Yeah I would have cashed out at $1,000 for sure.

And there's no guarantee that you can get rid of your BTC.

Yes it's harder to do a currency conversion on this that it is an official currency. That goes without saying and has been covered to death in this thread.

This is more of a digital/virtual commodity at this point than a digital/virtual currency.

 

[ChristianProgressive]

Clearly, you don't understand what counterfeit means. Bitcoin isn't attempting to pass itself off as anything other than an anti-inflationary digital crypto-currency, which so far is acting more like an asset than a currency.

Whatever name you chose to put on it, the fact remains that only a sovereign government may issue valid currency. Bitcoin and all other "cryptocurrencies" are therefore de facto not legal currency.

 

[psionl0]

So?

 

[Tippit]

Whatever name you chose to put on it, the fact remains that only a sovereign government may issue valid currency. Bitcoin and all other "cryptocurrencies" are therefore de facto not legal currency.

You're shifting goalposts. First you claimed incorrectly that bitcoin was a "counterfeit" of something. Now you're claiming that it's just not "valid", whatever that means. By claiming that bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies are not "legal" currency, are you suggesting that it should be outlawed, or that it is just not legal tender? Are people not free to design their own currencies when it is so clear to many including me that our current monetary system is beyond corrupt?

 

[PartSkeptic]

And just a few days after $10,000 it is now at $11,500.

Amazing.

Imagine, just a few years ago you could have bought just 1 bitcoin at $100 and now cash out at $11,500.

The ones at the top of the Ponzi scheme do exceptionally well. Everyone thinks they can cash out before the crash.

When the 1970s gold speculation finally peaked and crashed the average Joe had no way of getting out quickly. If all the Bitcoin holders decide to cash in quickly it could drop to almost nothing overnight.

Imagine if your dollar currency was that volatile?

 

[Fudbucker]

Nobody seems capable of explaining why bitcoin is useful to the average person. Bitcoins, to me, are as useful as tulips. I can't get cash back with them, I can't establish credit with it, I can't use bitcoin to float a zero-percent loan for 12 months while I pay off high-interest debt, and there's no intermediary between the merchant and my money if a dispute arises.

Other than buying illegal stuff or trying to avoid tax, what good is it?

 

[psionl0]

Nobody seems capable of explaining why bitcoin is useful to the average person.

Welcome to the bitcoin threads. You have many hours of entertaining reading about the pros and cons of bitcoin ahead of you.

The tl;dr version is that (provided you take adequate security measures) nobody can take your bitcoins away from you and nobody can scrutinize the way you spend bitcoins. It's like cash without the cash.

 

[Fudbucker]

Welcome to the bitcoin threads. You have many hours of entertaining reading about the pros and cons of bitcoin ahead of you.

The tl;dr version is that (provided you take adequate security measures) nobody can take your bitcoins away from you and nobody can scrutinize the way you spend bitcoins. It's like cash without the cash.

Like a lot of Americans, I don't use cash much. I'd much rather get rewards points on my card.

And I want my credit card scrutinizing how I spend. They once called me to ask if I was buying shoes in New York (I live in California).

And are you claiming bitcoins can't be stolen?

 

[psionl0]

And are you claiming bitcoins can't be stolen?

You can't say "can't". Bitcoins can be more secure than cash under the mattress or money in the bank (which can be subject to garnishment).

Credit cards can have some advantages (including the ability to reverse some transactions) but you were asking about bitcoin.

 

[PartSkeptic]

I was totally surprised when I looked at the TV business channel and saw gold, oil and bitcoin listed as key indices.

If you do not personally ensure that your bitcoin is entered into the block-chain ledger then your bitcoin is a secure as the company trading your bitcoin. They take your REAL money and they disappear and so does your account.

And if the nodes decide not to host the block chain anymore, then pooof - no more block chain and no more bitcoin.

The mechanism is too cumbersome for daily transactions. The one person I know who actually bought bitcoin is keeping it and waiting for the value to go up. Will he sell before it implodes? I might as well ask my Tarot cards...

 

[This is The End]

The ones at the top of the Ponzi scheme do exceptionally well. Everyone thinks they can cash out before the crash.

When the 1970s gold speculation finally peaked and crashed the average Joe had no way of getting out quickly. If all the Bitcoin holders decide to cash in quickly it could drop to almost nothing overnight.

I don't think anyone is denying that this thing can and probably will crash. And crash hard. Like 95% down hard.

But that doesn't mean you cannot get fantastically rich before it happens!

All investments are gambling. We're basically in a gambling thread and every 5 posts a poster, for whatever reason, thinks it is important to post about how this is gambling. That just seems weird to me.

The main point is that the people who said the crash is going to happen at every single stage turned out to be wrong, wrongity, wrong wrong wrong

Oh and btw, it went up another 3,000 in just a few days...

Someone who first invested just a few days ago could cash out right now with a decent little payout. They wouldn't have been "the ones at the top of the Ponzi scheme". Not by several years.

 

[This is The End]

Nobody seems capable of explaining why bitcoin is useful to the average person.

"Nobody seems capable of explaining why gold is useful to the average person."

So what?


(Actually the better analogy would be diamonds, since gold is actually very rare.)

 

[PartSkeptic]

"Nobody seems capable of explaining why gold is useful to the average person."

So what?


(Actually the better analogy would be diamonds, since gold is actually very rare.)

Gold was mined because it was easy at first to get the nuggets and melt them. The use was jewellery. It is inert and does not react chemically. It can be beaten into very fine thread.

Because it was rare and valued by kings it was used as trade. Gold could buy wheat or slaves. It became the backing of currency. Recently it is used extensively in electronics.

Bitcoin should just have a nominal value to represent the exchange value in a trade. The value is now speculative - people buy not to trade but to make a profit by buying, holding and then selling high (they hope).

 

[psionl0]

Bitcoin should just have a nominal value to represent the exchange value in a trade.

Why? Nothing else has a "nominal" value - just a market value.

 

[Fudbucker]

"Nobody seems capable of explaining why gold is useful to the average person."

So what?


(Actually the better analogy would be diamonds, since gold is actually very rare.)

Lame. Gold is in a lot of electronics people use. People wear it. It doesn't tarnish. If gold vanished, it would be a shock to the system. If bitcoin vanished, life would go on.