bad thoughts make water bad

[thoth108]

Sorry if I offended you.

If you want to explore the science to this (after admitting that scientific evidence is lacking), perhaps you should begin by not misusing well-established scientific words such as "frequency".



Translation: I don't understand your point. Moreover, I don't want to understand your point, so don't bother explaining it.

I understand your point NobbyNobb, I just don't think it's relative. Explain it more if you think it's a good one.

Pictures are too open to interpretation. The ice crystals would be more precise for scientific study.

My use of frequency in conjunction with dimension still stands from my perspective, which is based on a shamanistic understanding of the world. Let's not go into that discussion just yet, it's spiritually over your head.

 

[thoth108]

Here's a little honesty for Paul.

Paul



The laughing you will here is not at the so-called unseen energies.

I'll be honest with you Paulhoff. You don't know about auroras, and are not "seeing" them in your daily life for a reason. You may go this entire life time and not see anything of which I speak. But that does not mean it isn't real, and your experience is not evidence that my experiences are false.

I have begun to see the unseen energies I'm talking about. There are thousands of people that I know of who are learning to see them as well, and you are still saying, "No. They're not there. Science will tell me ALL I need to know." But science doesn't see the aurora Paul. People keep telling you about them, but you can't see them, and so you and all the rest of the people who can't see auroras all get together and defend your perspective.

I was there once. I listened to what a good teacher had to say, and I practised diligently, and slowly I begin to see what others were talking about. Before I saw with my own eyes I was a non-believer. But once I saw the same chakras on a living person, with my own eyes, that a chinese seer described seeing 4000 years ago, and a South American Shaman describes exactly the same way I see it, then I began to accept the idea that I was filtering out some visual information in my daily state of mind. Little by little I see more of the unseen world each day.

Meditation leads to spiritual sight: being able to see auroras. It takes practice, and you have to know what to look for and how to encourage your mind to stop filtering out the right information. It takes PRACTICE. That's why so few succeed in getting results. It's also why scientist have yet to "discover" the chakras, and the aurora; no one in the scientific community has really, honestly tried to meditate until they get it right. It's not something easily attained (and for a very good reason, if you'll consider the consequences of everyone having soul-sight).

I really don't mind that you don't believe me, and I don't mind that you laugh at me. What you don't know is, when I'm done here chatting with you about soul-travel, and out-of-body woo-woo, and such I'm going to lay down and meditate and experience again the very things that you don't "believe" in. I know it's true from first hand experience.

I was you. Then I tried to see with my best intent. Now I'm trying to show you that it isn't impossible.

 

[Normal Dude]

But John Wheeler's experiment is evidence that thought can effect the outcome of the experiment...

Incorrect. The experimenter's thought is affecting the outcome of the experiment about as much as my thinking about brewing a pot of coffee gets it brewed. Something PHYSICAL happens that decides the outcome of the experiment. Can you tell me what it is? Hint: I've already stated what it is.

I think this should still be studied more, and that scientists like yourselves should open your mind to possibilities, instead of being superstitious of everything "woo-woo".

Please tell me how scientists are being superstitious in this regard.

John Wheeler's experiment shows us that light, and therefore everything that our eyes "see" is relative to what we expect it to be.

This view is based off of an incorrect assumption of the experiment. See above.

Further experiments in what we "see" will begin to reveal that we can see more colors/frequencies of the electro-magnetic spectrum than we currently use each day, and much of this "invisible" interraction between experimenter and experiment will become visible to our naked eyes once more people learn to expand their sensitivity, and spread the knowledge of what they "see."

So are you claiming that these auroras and energies are a part of the electromagnetic spectrum?

The two topics are related in that YOU are people who can not see the extended spectrum, and so the idea of "invisible" energies touching the water during the experiment is ludacris to you. You want to measure these invisible energies, and aurora, and "see" them for yourselves, right ? Light is playing tricks on your eyes, and your eyes (or rather the mental process of organizing the incoming visual stimulai into logical components) are eliminating the aurora, and countless other unimportant things going on around you. To put it simply, you are in YOUR OWN WORLD. And you put yourself there.

So in other words, everyone who doesn't agree with you is deluded?

I am looking for people who are interested in exploring the science to this

Please explain to me, in your own words, what you believe science is.



If you want to believe what you believe, fine with me. No problem at all. But when you start dragging misrepresented scientific findings and name-dropping to support your claim, I get irked. What is more, your condescending attitude of everyone who does not share your rather remarkable world view is irritating. I guess I should be thanking you for the grace of educating us lower life forms.

 

[six7s]

... I began to accept the idea that I was filtering out some visual information in my daily state of mind. Little by little I see more of the unseen world each day.

Meditation leads to spiritual sight: being able to see auroras. It takes practice, and you have to know what to look for...

Please describe an example (or three) of any information that can be obtained through "spiritual sight: being able to see auroras"

 

[Paulhoff]

I'll be honest with you Paulhoff. You don't know about auroras, and are not "seeing" them in your daily life for a reason. You may go this entire life time and not see anything of which I speak. But that does not mean it isn't real, and your experience is not evidence that my experiences are false.

No, you don't know about auroras because there are none. For one you only talk about them, you don't show how they would work, you don't prove that they are there, you only say that they do, you so-called experience has nothing to do with facts and or reality, they are only your delusion. This only shows that you haven't the slightest idea about the world around you and don’t know the right way to prove anything. I do not have to prove you experiences are false, it is on you to prove that they are real, it is no different then you having to prove that you went to Japan to anyone, just saying it doesn’t make it so, just saying that you have experiences does not make it so. A crazy person has experiences to, it does not make them true.

I have begun to see the unseen energies I'm talking about. There are thousands of people that I know of who are learning to see them as well, and you are still saying, "No. They're not there. Science will tell me ALL I need to know." But science doesn't see the aurora Paul. People keep telling you about them, but you can't see them, and so you and all the rest of the people who can't see auroras all get together and defend your perspective.
This in no way is a proof, it is no different then my saying I have seen pink flying elephants, prove to me I'm wrong.

I was there once. I listened to what a good teacher had to say, and I practised diligently, and slowly I begin to see what others were talking about. Before I saw with my own eyes I was a non-believer. But once I saw the same chakras on a living person, with my own eyes, that a chinese seer described seeing 4000 years ago, and a South American Shaman describes exactly the same way I see it, then I began to accept the idea that I was filtering out some visual information in my daily state of mind. Little by little I see more of the unseen world each day.

Sorry but delusions are not proof. 4000 years ago they had no idea about how the body was made so they came up with something to explain the unknown. Now you only show that you can’t accept the truth of how the universe works because you need magical thinking to make it work for your needs. Your needs do make it true.

Meditation leads to spiritual sight: being able to see auroras. It takes practice, and you have to know what to look for and how to encourage your mind to stop filtering out the right information. It takes PRACTICE. That's why so few succeed in getting results. It's also why scientist have yet to "discover" the chakras, and the aurora; no one in the scientific community has really, honestly tried to meditate until they get it right. It's not something easily attained (and for a very good reason, if you'll consider the consequences of everyone having soul-sight).
Well this only shows me that you meditation leads to false thinking. And you also seem to think that the scientific community is not made of people and that many of them do meditate. They have done the tests and no chakras, no auroras.

I really don't mind that you don't believe me, and I don't mind that you laugh at me. What you don't know is, when I'm done here chatting with you about soul-travel, and out-of-body woo-woo, and such I'm going to lay down and meditate and experience again the very things that you don't "believe" in. I know it's true from first hand experience.
Well if you don't mind, why are you here. I don't laugh at you, I only feel sorry for you, because you are missing so much.

I was you. Then I tried to see with my best intent. Now I'm trying to show you that it isn't impossible.

You where never me, you only see what you what to see and that is a magical world. Saying that something isn't impossible does not make it real.

Paul

 

[NobbyNobbs]

I'll be honest with you Paulhoff. You don't know about auroras, and are not "seeing" them in your daily life for a reason. You may go this entire life time and not see anything of which I speak. But that does not mean it isn't real, and your experience is not evidence that my experiences are false.

I have begun to see the unseen energies I'm talking about. There are thousands of people that I know of who are learning to see them as well, and you are still saying, "No. They're not there. Science will tell me ALL I need to know." But science doesn't see the aurora Paul. People keep telling you about them, but you can't see them, and so you and all the rest of the people who can't see auroras all get together and defend your perspective.

I was there once. I listened to what a good teacher had to say, and I practised diligently, and slowly I begin to see what others were talking about. Before I saw with my own eyes I was a non-believer. But once I saw the same chakras on a living person, with my own eyes, that a chinese seer described seeing 4000 years ago, and a South American Shaman describes exactly the same way I see it, then I began to accept the idea that I was filtering out some visual information in my daily state of mind. Little by little I see more of the unseen world each day.

The same argument could be made for leprechauns, unicorns, fairies, and the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Does that mean that, by default, they exist too? If not, please explain the difference between the logic for belief in auras (I suspect this is what you mean, not auroras. Auroras exist, and can be seen occasionally on a clear night north of a certain latitude) and the logic for belief in these other ideas.

And I too do not appreciate your condescending attitude.

 

[Michael C]

First, to clarify (thanks to my old Concise Oxford Dictionary):

Aurora, Luminous atmospheric phenomenon radiating from earth's northern (aurora borealis) or southern (aurora australis) magnetic pole.

Aura, Subtle emanation, atmosphere diffused by or attending a person (esp. in mystical use as a definite envelope of body or spirit).

I take it that thoth108 is claiming to see people's auras. This is easy to test. First I have two questions:

1. Can you see a person's aura if that person is behind a screen?

2. Can you see a person's aura if the person is completely covered by clothing (wearing gloves, face obscured by a mask, ect.)?

 

[Baron Samedi]

I don't think this is relative. Your argument generalizes more than it deducts, and while it's amusing I just don't think it's related. Please don't go on in another post explaining it either.

I think that a person's thoughts effect their aurora; their aurora effects reality around them. This is the basis for Emoto's experiment, and it is in line with my own understanding of reality. [insert laughter from other member's here]

I understand your point NobbyNobb, I just don't think it's relative. Explain it more if you think it's a good one.

Go back to my theoretical situation. Replace taking pictures of people with taking pictures of frozen water. You now have Emoto's "experiment". If my example is not relevant to your argument about creating reality, then neither is Emoto's.

 

[thoth108]

Getting away from all this BabyMomma's Drama!

I'm leaving the JREF forums. I've spent too much time here over the last month or so, thinking I was going to bring something to this place. I also arouse too much emotion; and I'm not interested in all of this petty debate. (that does not apply to all of you, just a few of the intellectual elitests around here). From my standpoint it isn't necessary to teach you all how quantum touch and energy healing works, or to defend it at all. It is what it is.

It's impossible to keep up with all the quoting and back and forth on these forum threads (I have a life); Honestly it be easier if you all would just pick up a book on auroras and find out for yourself (beyond trusting that science would have found it if it were real). There is a lot that science does not know about yet. Let's just leave it at that.

Oh, if you watch "What the bleep do we know??" (I'm SURE you ALL have a COPY !!! ), The part about "reality only being there when we check on it" is an EXACT description of how spiritual sight looks: It is REALITY when we're NOT LOOKING AT IT. All potentials at once, with the most likely ones becoming clearer as they begin to manifest; but ALWAYS what you see in the spiritual sight, precedes it's action or manifestation in the physical world. I am not that developed yet, but I will come back here when I can perform repeated tests at will. At present time I can only hold the spiritual sight for a few seconds, and I've got my own experiments to concentrate on for now.

For those of you who found my posts interesting, study from shamans; then take up esoteric literature, then learn alchemy. Science is missing the "spiritual" part of reality, and all of those teachings include it. I'll see you all outside the box. (tesseract, that is...)

Peace and Compassionate Love to you ALL ! We are all beings of LIGHT.

Many of you are wonderful people. Some of us are just plain weird.

 

[Paulhoff]

Many of you are wonderful people. Some of us are just plain weird.

To bad your going, but logical thinking is not weird to many of us here.

Paul

 

[jsiv]

I see auroras all the time.

 

[NobbyNobbs]

I'm leaving the JREF forums. I've spent too much time here over the last month or so, thinking I was going to bring something to this place. I also arouse too much emotion; and I'm not interested in all of this petty debate. (that does not apply to all of you, just a few of the intellectual elitests around here). From my standpoint it isn't necessary to teach you all how quantum touch and energy healing works, or to defend it at all. It is what it is.

Amazing. After 32 posts, you've just worn yourself out. However did you last so long? Over the last month or so, that means about a post a day, so maybe 5 minutes worth of time. I don't know how you fit it into your busy schedule.

It's impossible to keep up with all the quoting and back and forth on these forum threads (I have a life); Honestly it be easier if you all would just pick up a book on auroras and find out for yourself (beyond trusting that science would have found it if it were real). There is a lot that science does not know about yet. Let's just leave it at that.

And yet, in all that time, and all those posts, you still don't realize that what you're talking about is "auras", and not "auroras"?! How old are you, anyway?

Some of us are just plain weird.