bad thoughts make water bad

I always find a glimmer of hope in stories like this:

In the real world, we are exposed to all kinds of BS, often from figures of authority. Growing up should prepare you for this, and it sounds like your daughter is doing just fine.

I also see a potential topic for a science fair project. Reality speaks louder than any "overreacting stink".
 
jimtron said:
How about for a school project your daughter conducts a double blind study to see if the teacher is right or wrong? Let the teacher (blindly) distinguish between the "negative" and "positive" water.
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See if the teacher is right or wrong? Seems like you've decided what the answer should be already, and are just out to get the teacher.

A better study would be "Gender and age differences in perception of negative and positive water".
 
SezMe said:
Yes, but this is yet another teaching opportunity. Being mortified is not a justification for not standing up for one's principles. She may be motified but think of the lesson she will learn when Dad stands up for his principles.
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Seconded. Be up-front and agressive about this outrage. If you don't take a stand and fight, who will?

Failure to confront the authorities about this nonsense due to fear of embarrassment is no better than the newage belief that warm and fuzzy feelings are more important than the truth. If standing up for the truth is embarrassing, then something is terribly wrong somewhere.
 
See if the teacher is right or wrong? Seems like you've decided what the answer should be already, and are just out to get the teacher.
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How does "see if the teacher is right or wrong" equal "I've decided the answer already"? Did you see my earlier post where I said:
Yeah, I like the experiment idea, because I think it would get through to people better. Instead of saying, "no, you're wrong" and having the teacher and possibly some students think you guys are just closed minded or whatever, you can say, "hmm, this doesn't sound plausible, but why don't we see for ourselves"? It is a school after all...
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My point is that it's better to be open minded and test it, as opposed to calling the teacher wrong. If the teacher is right, the test will reflect that. I'm interested in the truth about this. If bad thoughts negatively affect water, I'd truly like to know that. It would be surprising and exciting.

Am I skeptical that thoughts affect the quality of water? Yes, very. However, I would be happy to look at evidence that shows otherwise, and this seems pretty simple to test.
 
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I'd take a bottle of swamp water, place it in front of the teacher and wait for his/her "good thoughts" make it better and then tell the teacher to drink it.

tbm
 
Some excellent suggestions.

Lionking, I teach up north in the fantasy land of Canberra. Different system, slightly, but the same principles apply. You and your daughter have a choice here;

1) Forget it and move on, chalking it up to a whacky belief a teacher has
2) Challenge it vocally, asking for evidence.
3) Challenge it openly, testing the claim in or out of class
4) Challenge it publically, bringing it to the attention of other educators and perhaps the media.

This obviously moves through a spectrum from the simple to the drastic. It depends on what effects you want. Personally, I feel it depends on what support your daughter has in the form of other teachers, students and the community. With little support she'll cause waves and get little out of it. With a lot of support, you could be making a statement that demonstrates science wins over a teacher's purported 'facts'.

PM me if you'd like some help in this.

Athon
 
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New age woo is like religion. Would they allow a teacher to teach creation or preach Jesus at you? This is the same. Bogus, unsubstantiated superstition. It does NOT belong in a school.
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I'm gradually growing more and more convinced that superstition and alternative stuff is the new 'world religion'. People are starting to realize mythologies from the Bronze Age aren't for them, but they have an instinct that gives them a need for mysticism in their life. Hence aura reading, channeling, fortune-tellers and all that other woo.
 
lionking - Before going "public" or complaining; perhaps you should start at the begining and ask the teacher to clarify/explain what she meant?
 
Locknar said:
lionking - Before going "public" or complaining; perhaps you should start at the begining and ask the teacher to clarify/explain what she meant?
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This is a good point. It's possible your child may have misunderstood / misremembered. Having said that - if the teacher confirms that this is what she's teaching, I'd write an official complaint - to the principal first, and plan to send one to the the school board etc...
 
True. Is there a chance the teacher was talking about the psychological component of taste (so-called acquired taste etc)? She may even have been trying to explain why a child thought water "tasted bad" when it doesn't have any actual ingredient. Best to confirm, just in case.
 
I've been away for a couple of days, so am just catching up. Thank you for the constructive comments and suggestions. I have decided to speak to the Principal tomorrow and see what her reactions are. If they decide to close ranks around the teacher I will let you know. BTW, I have asked a couple of Hannah's classmates about the lesson (in an understated, humourous manner at a sleepover - wont I be sorry when these stop!) and they both confirmed her version about what the teacher said.
 
Away? Who allowed that! :)

Kidding aside, eager to hear what folks at the school say. I'm sure what your daughter, and the others said, was accurate...though I still think you should start by asking the teacher.

It could be as simple as the teacher making a joke that went tragically wrong (ie. nobody got it, or took her seriously). Of course, it could also be a bit of "woo woo"....
 
Locknar said:
Away? Who allowed that! :)

Kidding aside, eager to hear what folks at the school say. I'm sure what your daughter, and the others said, was accurate...though I still think you should start by asking the teacher.

It could be as simple as the teacher making a joke that went tragically wrong (ie. nobody got it, or took her seriously). Of course, it could also be a bit of "woo woo"....
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I was in the Emerald City AKA Sydney and my laptop broadband card was out of order. You may not know much about Sydney (an unforgivable assumption I know) but it is recognised as one of the most expensive cities in the world to live in, and all everybody seems to talk about is the value of their properties or how they cant live where they want to. Magnificant city (and where I was born) but glad I now live in Melbourne.
Back to your point, I'm a bit like Cartman and can't abide hippies, so I am not inclined to talk to her and put up with her justifications. Life's too short.......
 
lionking said:
I have decided to talk to the Principal next week and suggest the experiment if the teacher in question persists in her lessons. Remember that we live in full-on hippie territory, so I expect that I will be told to respect other's beliefs. Will let you know how I go.
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reading through this thread, seems to me that making the teacher do the testing is a very good idea! I would certainly recommend an assertive approach where the Principal and the teacher concerned end up thanking you for your help! That way, you are more likely to be able to exert more influence at a later date if necessary.

This next sentence might sound patronising, but I assure you absolutely that it is not intended that way. I'm sure you probably know this, but a successful assertive conversation needs to be quite well rehearsed.

(By the way, I used to teach year 6.)
 
I'm confused. I thought that Emoto used proper procedure in his tests. He used a distilled bottle of water. Put a drop onto 50 different plates. Froze them. Took a photo of each individual drop. Unfroze them. Then had one blessed by a monk, or another given thoughts of love or kindness, and the rest were not touched or had though directed to them. Then they were re-frozen, and again had up close pictures taken of each one.

Could someone please explain the errors with this procedure or provide more information on what is wrong with his study?
 
If you decide that public exposure is the way to go, don't contact the media, thereby embarrassing your daughter.

Instead, let her contact the media. Not only will the problem get fixed, but she'll be famous from being on TV and hailed by her classmates as the student who took down a teacher.

And the media will love it.
 
There's no science in this thread, only blind doubt.

The_Animus said:
I'm confused. I thought that Emoto used proper procedure in his tests. He used a distilled bottle of water. Put a drop onto 50 different plates. Froze them. Took a photo of each individual drop. Unfroze them. Then had one blessed by a monk, or another given thoughts of love or kindness, and the rest were not touched or had though directed to them. Then they were re-frozen, and again had up close pictures taken of each one.

Could someone please explain the errors with this procedure or provide more information on what is wrong with his study?
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I'm with you on this one Animus. I think that Emoto's tests are a great way of showing that not only DOES the process work, but HOW the process works.

As for the class doing a test of their own, I'll have to say this; The point of this experiment is that what people think can effect the water as it is forming into ice crystals... If you are all convinced that it WON'T WORK, then that is what you will get. It sounds religous but it isn't. It all boils down to science. The point is that Emoto got results because he did it correctly(we should seek to replicate his test with more scrutiny, to verify his results in repeated tests or find out why there were apparent results in the first place). I think that most of the people in here are too focused on the negative aspects of this to give it a fair try.:o

When this experiment doesn't work it won't be a surprise to me. If it was lead by people who truly were unbiased to the possible results, and focused their MINDS with the intention necessary for the results to occur, then we could move past this "disbelief."

Can't any of you see a possible scientific explanation that PROVES Dr. Emoto's theories ?:confused:
 
Theories on Ice Crystals forming...

jimtron said:
How does "see if the teacher is right or wrong" equal "I've decided the answer already"? Did you see my earlier post where I said: My point is that it's better to be open minded and test it, as opposed to calling the teacher wrong. If the teacher is right, the test will reflect that. I'm interested in the truth about this. If bad thoughts negatively affect water, I'd truly like to know that. It would be surprising and exciting.

Am I skeptical that thoughts affect the quality of water? Yes, very. However, I would be happy to look at evidence that shows otherwise, and this seems pretty simple to test.
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I'm interested in this as well, and I'm really glad to get the opportunity to say that I agree with jimtron on something.

Something about the findings of Dr Emoto have always rung true with me. Just to verbalize what side I'm on. I think that the thoughts of those present during the experiment do effect the experiment; in this case the thoughts of the scientist effect the shape of the ice crystals.

Aren't there experiments where this has been proven with "light" as well ?;)
 
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