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A religious question ...

Patrick

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... for any follower of the Abrahamic religions.

Say you die. Afterwards, when you "come to", you see Ganesh the Elephant God before the pearly gates. He says "Ah, _________ (fill in your name). He motions to two burly guards, and they take you to an elevator that's labeled "Straight To Hell" and is flashing the "Down" arrow. You say "Wait a minute! Why're you doing this??". As the guards toss you into the elevator, Ganesh says "you picked Abraham/Jesus/Mohammad (pick one) and you were wrong, it's me, Ganesh, that's the true god!". As the doors clang shut, you scream "There were lots of religions - I picked one!". As the elevator plummets down at high speed, you barely hear Ganesh say "You picked wrong, sucker!".

Now, waddaya got to say about that?
 
"I want to talk with the manager!"?

I am not a follower of an Abrahamic religion. But one could answer: "I did my best to pick the religion which I think is most likely to be true. Maybe I made a mistake. Nevertheless, I optimized my chances."

Another possible answer: "But I know that my religion is true, because I can feel it in my heart."

Besides, your example seems to be flawed: Hinduism doesn't claim that you go to hell for believing in Jahwe.
 
Besides, your example seems to be flawed: Hinduism doesn't claim that you go to hell for believing in Jahwe.


The point was (think Diogenes said this?) "Where there are 1000 religions we are likely to be skeptical of them all." The one chosen by most people seems to be an accident of where they were born, who their parents were, etc.
 
Now, waddaya got to say about that?
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I would probably say. Couldn't you have e-mailed us that you were the real deal? Why the guessing game.
At least corporations have meetings when managment is changing hands.

What a cheap god that you couldn't afford a few post-it notes or a memo. Sheesh!
 
religion is a creation or institution of man. If there is a god, I'm sure the religion would have absolutely nothing to do that god.
 
Even worse: There are Christian sects that have membership in the millions, yet maintain that only 100,000 will be "saved".

I mean, what'r your chances?
 
Patrick said:
The point was (think Diogenes said this?) "Where there are 1000 religions we are likely to be skeptical of them all." The one chosen by most people seems to be an accident of where they were born, who their parents were, etc.
Click to expand...

Yeah, yeah. But if that was the point, then why not say so? Why use a flawed example if Diogenes explained it flawless in fewer words?
 
Yeah, yeah. But if that was the point, then why not say so? Why use a flawed example if Diogenes explained it flawless in fewer words?

Why carp and biitch and pick?
 
Why the guessing game.

EXACTLY! E.g., both Islam and Christianity demand an expression of faith. Which one to pick, even among just those two? And if you pick wrong, you end up in hell? Why not an unambiguous demonstration of God, whoever he is? Then everyone knows for sure, and you don't have to guess! There's a lot of things like this in the major religions that leave me baffled.
 
There is only one sun in the sky, albeit every living species of plants which, manifest themselves differently, will attest that this is the very sun which allows them to do so. However, it may not be couched in terms understood by other plant varieties. ;)
 
There is only one sun in the sky, albeit every living species of plants which, manifest themselves differently, will attest that this is the very sun which allows them to do so. However, it may not be couched in terms understood by other plant varieties.
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What about mushrooms and fungi? They don't need the sun.
 
There is only one sun in the sky

If only God manifested himself as clearly as the sun! (Hmmmm .... Apollo? Helios? Ra?)
 
Patrick said:

There is only one sun in the sky

If only God manifested himself as clearly as the sun! (Hmmmm .... Apollo? Helios? Ra?)
Click to expand...
Hey, did you know that God appears as the sun in heaven? Oh, and did you know that Plato equated the Form of the Good with the sun? Which, makes perfect sense if you understood what he's trying to say. For example, we see by the light of the sun (the truth) and are sustained by its warmth (the good). In which case we're speaking of that which is central to life on earth as we know it. So why shouldn't God appear as the sun in heaven?

While here's an interesting dream that I had, where I came up from the depths to experience the Sun of Heaven.
 
Iacchus said:
Hey, did you know that God appears as the sun in heaven?
Click to expand...

No, didn't knew that, that's big news. I used to think it's just a great bubble of hydrogen fusing.

By the way, many people by now have told you that there is more than one sun.


Oh, and did you know that Plato equated the Form of the Good with the sun?
Click to expand...

As far as I know, Plato didn't equate the idea of the good with the sun; he just used a metaphor: the sun is not the same thing as the idea of the good (according to Plato), the sun just plays the same role in the physical world as the idea of the good plays in the heaven of ideas.
 
jan said:

No, didn't knew that, that's big news. I used to think it's just a great bubble of hydrogen fusing.
Click to expand...
Must be more to it than that, at the very least in the representative sense if, in fact it's what sustains life on this planet.


By the way, many people by now have told you that there is more than one sun.
Click to expand...
With respect to life on this planet? No.


As far as I know, Plato didn't equate the idea of the good with the sun; he just used a metaphor: the sun is not the same thing as the idea of the good (according to Plato), the sun just plays the same role in the physical world as the idea of the good plays in the heaven of ideas.
Click to expand...
It's an excellent illustration nonetheless.

So, did you know that the idea of God is "central" to most religions?
 
Iacchus said:
Must be more to it than that, at the very least in the representative sense if, in fact it's what sustains life on this planet.
Click to expand...

I knew that the sun plays an important role in many mythological systems. That doesn't alter the fact that the sun is not a god, as far as I know.

Do you think that the sun is literally a god?

With respect to life on this planet? No.
Click to expand...

There may be only one sun that sustains life on this planet. That doesn't alter the fact that there are many suns. And perhaps one of those other suns sustains life on another planet.

It's an excellent illustration nonetheless.
Click to expand...

Perhaps. And perhaps not. In the "Parmenides", Plato seems to claim that there are negative ideas. It's difficult to adjust this with the concept of the idea of good as the sun that brings all the other ideas to life.

So, did you know that the idea of God is "central" to most religions?
Click to expand...

I assume "central" means something like "important". And did you know that our sun is not the center of the universe? And that many religions claimed the earth to be the center of the universe?

Also, I find it doubtful whether Plato imagined the idea of good as some kind of god. When he talks about gods, he talks about gods; when he talks about ideas, he talks about ideas (or "forms", if you prefer).
 
jan said:
I am not a follower of an Abrahamic religion. But one could answer: "I did my best to pick the religion which I think is most likely to be true. Maybe I made a mistake. Nevertheless, I optimized my chances."
Click to expand...

My question to this response would be... what methodology did that person use to determine which was more likely to be true?

Could it be, "Which one validated the most of my existing beliefs?"
 
Bikewer said:
Even worse: There are Christian sects that have membership in the millions, yet maintain that only 100,000 will be "saved".

I mean, what'r your chances?
Click to expand...

It's 144,000. And they're all male virgins or female heterosexuals. But close enough.
 
With respect to life on this planet? No.

Life owes its existence on this planet to many suns, if you want to get into the astrophysics.
 
Yep, ours is at best a 2nd generation model, and maybe third.

Male virgins? Ye gads, how do they attract converts?
 
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