• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

General Israel/Palestine discussion thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
bikerdruid said:
if the PA actually claims to represent all palestinians, they cannot ignore fatah and hamas.
Click to expand...
So you admit that Hamas, which lists extermination of the Jews as one of its founding principles and regularly engages in virulent anti-semitic rhetoric and propaganda, has significant support among Palestinians?

bikerdruid said:
one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.
Click to expand...
For example, modern-day white supremacists think of Hitler as a freedom fighter.
 
Last edited:
bikerdruid said:
i can type....
"be sure to not kill the jews."
-Haj Amin al-Husseini.

...... and have it hold as much evidence.

some dude that has been dead for nearly a century is hardly relevant, especially without proper references.
Click to expand...

It comes from the speech broadcast on the Nazi-backed "Voice of Free Arabism" that I posted earlier. Here it is again:


In the face of this barbaric procedure by the British we think it best, if the life of the Egyptian nation is to be saved, that the Egyptians rise as one man to kill the Jews before they have a chance of betraying the Egyptian people. It is the duty of the Egyptians to annihilate the Jews and to destroy their property. … You must kill the Jews, before they open fire on you. Kill the Jews, who have appropriated your wealth and who are plotting against your security. Arabs of Syria, Iraq, and Palestine, what are you waiting for? The Jews are planning to violate your women, to kill your children and to destroy you. According to the Muslim religion, the defense of your life is a duty which can only be fulfilled by annihilating the Jews. This is your best opportunity to get rid of this dirty race, which has usurped your rights and brought misfortune and destruction on your countries. Kill the Jews, burn their property, destroy their stores, annihilate these base supporters of British imperialism. Your sole hope of salvation lies in annihilating the Jews before they annihilate you.
Click to expand...

http://www.chroniclecareers.com/arti...anda-in/49199/
 
So the flotilla summary so far: The captain of the Audacity of Hope has been arrested after trying to leave port without permission, and his supporters are outraged at the conditions of his jailing. Boo freaking hoo as far as I care.

And remember the claims from the Irish boat that they were sabotaged by the Jews Israel? Turkish authorities say there's no sign of sabotage. In other words, the flotilla activists are just making stuff up. But is it really a lie if it's done to make Israel look bad? Remember, one man's lie is another man's truth... or something.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-14004758
 
bikerdruid said:
if the PA actually claims to represent all palestinians, they cannot ignore fatah and hamas.
one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.
Click to expand...

Are Hamas and Fatah your freedom fighters?

Because they're my crooks, gangsters and supremacist radicals.
 
Virus said:
Are Hamas and Fatah your freedom fighters?

Because they're my crooks, gangsters and supremacist radicals.
Click to expand...

I guess you could consider Hamas freedom fighters, if you wanted to free the world of Jews. Fortunately, they are mostly inept.
 
From the report: "The captain is being held by the police and will be brought before a judge on Tuesday. The Greek Coast Guard claims he will be accused of attempting to leave the port without proper permits and endangering the lives of the boat's passengers."

No mention of terrorism.
 
GlennB said:
From the report: "The captain is being held by the police and will be brought before a judge on Tuesday. The Greek Coast Guard claims he will be accused of attempting to leave the port without proper permits and endangering the lives of the boat's passengers."

No mention of terrorism.
Click to expand...

AS misrepresenting a news story? Surely not?
 
bikerdruid said:
if the PA actually claims to represent all palestinians, they cannot ignore fatah and hamas.
one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.
Click to expand...

True. For some people, holocaust-denying, genocide-supporting, fascist Islamist theocracts like Hamas who randomly kill Jews are "freedom fighters".

Those people are known as "Jew haters".
 
HoverBoarder said:
Ok, well there are a few points to that.

First of all, let's get to the heart of it. The Hamas charter that calls for the destruction of Israel was not made so that they can have self-determination for themselves, it is included because they want to suppress the self-determination of the Jewish people living near them.
If the the eskimo's suddenly decided that they were sick of the cold, and needed somewhere warmer to live, and chose Palestine to move to, there would be calls for the deaths of eskimos'.

You cannot just declare that the right to be able to have self-determination for the Palestinians means the right to kill those people near them who are not the same race and religion. They don't have a right to wage a genocidal race war.


What they do have a right to is their rights under the UN declaration of Human Rights. They also should have a right to self-determination, but that does not include the right to call for the destruction of Israel.
Click to expand...
I don't support the destruction of Israel. But here you have a problem, clash of rights to self determination. The Zionist plan largely amounted to

Create Israel.
??????
Peace.

There was debate about the unknown part, but everyone pretty well knew that there would be conflict, and that how peace would eventuate. If you look at other areas such as Australia, Northern Ireland, the USA, the conflict can go on for centuries. In Northern Ireland, there are still people dying. Not as many as before, and not due to a lack of trying. This isn't about Jews and anti-semitism, it's about trying to jam two pegs into the one hole. Portraying this as being purely about anti-semitism is just a distraction from the real issues. There is anti-semitism involved, but reducing this complex matter to a single issue is just one more roadblock to peace.
As for Netanyahu, he has definitely been trying very hard to sabotage the peace process since he started. Which is something that I understand given his party's positions, but is something that I definitely do not agree with. It is a position that I would consider very damaging to Israel on many levels, and is not in Israel's best interests.
Click to expand...

That is what is self defeating in just hating your enemies, and it applies to both sides. It simplifies the issue a lot, and unifies your people through 'wedge' politics, "are you with us or them", and can only result in more conflict. The actual anti-semitism, such as there was no holocaust, the Jews are secretly controlling the banks, the "Protocols" and other such rubbish, does not advance the cause of the Palestinians. Ditto the Netanyahu's and the even more radical groups, which wield power out of proportion to their democratic representation due to the need to have coalitions of disparate political parties to gain government. YESHA wants the west bank cleared out, Palestinian free.

Then there are the practical issues, such as water. Israel cannot maintain it's current "Western" lifestyle without the 'western aquifer', that is, the West Bank.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
A humanitarian?

Gun runner to terrorists pretending to be a humanitarian. Using stupid leftists as human shields.
 
a_unique_person said:
The actual anti-semitism, such as there was no holocaust, the Jews are secretly controlling the banks, the "Protocols" and other such rubbish, does not advance the cause of the Palestinians.
Click to expand...

It does if their cause is killing Jews.

Hamas leader:



"The Jews are brought in droves to Palestine, so that the Palestinians - and the Islamic nation behind them - will have the honour of annihilating the evil of this gang."

But it's not about Jews!
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom