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Wow, UK has lost freedom of speech

And don't forget she pleaded guilty to the offence. The appeal was only against the sentence she received.
Irrelevant. She was given terrible advice by her lawyer. Ricky Jones (a Labour councillor) was recorded on video directly urging for throats to be cut, which is far worse than anything Connolly posted, and was found not guilty.

Note the double standard at play here: Tweet the wrong thing in Britain and you'll be arrested and possibly serve prison time. Tweet the wrong thing in Egypt, and the British government will bring you there, put you up, pay for your child's special school, and all of this while you call Britons monkeys and dogs and boast about how much you hate white people.

You get sentenced to 2+ years prison for a hurty tweet with "anti-immigrant sentiment", but when this guy just straight up calls for genocide, he is rewarded with a ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ passport.

Lets be clear here. Starmer bragged about bringing an openly pro-violence, pro-terrorist, anti-British, anti-White, racist anti-Semite into the UK, and none of you have expressed any real objection, so I have to take it that many of you are just fine with it. Starmer is now trying to claim he had no idea about El_Fattah's social media posts. But he is a liar. He raised this very issue in Parliament three years ago when he was in Opposition!!
 
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In a statement issued in the early hours of Monday morning, after a day of frantic consultations, he wrote: “Looking at the tweets now – the ones that were not completely twisted out of their meaning – I do understand how shocking and hurtful they are, and for that I unequivocally apologise.

“They were mostly expressions of a young man’s anger and frustrations in a time of regional crises (the wars on Iraq, on Lebanon and Gaza), and the rise of police brutality against Egyptian youth. I particularly regret some that were written as part of online insult battles with the total disregard for how they read to other people. I should have known better.”
 
"In a statement issued in the early hours of Monday morning, after a day of frantic consultations, he wrote: “Looking at the tweets now – the ones that were not completely twisted out of their meaning – I do understand how shocking and hurtful they are, and for that I unequivocally apologise.
“They were mostly expressions of a young man’s anger and frustrations in a time of regional crises (the wars on Iraq, on Lebanon and Gaza), and the rise of police brutality against Egyptian youth. I particularly regret some that were written as part of online insult battles with the total disregard for how they read to other people. I should have known better.”

..."the ones that were not completely twisted out of their meaning"!?? Really?? ..."if we can't kill the officers, let us find a terroristic cell to kill their children and torture their mothers". How the ◊◊◊◊ do you twist that out of its meaning? Seriously? Who the ◊◊◊◊ does this scumbag think he's kidding?

Actually, I take that back. Pathetic bleeding heart liberal progressives will swallow this transparent, self-serving bollocks by the gobfull. Well I'm not fooled... not for a second. I don't believe him - I don't believe anyone with such a vile worldview can have a sudden kumbaya moment and be truly sorry for such disgusting tripe.

He's just sorry he got found out.
 
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He's had ten ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ years in an Egyptian prison.
Which would harden most people.

You don't think someone can change after that?
Possible, barely

Once a criminal, always a criminal, is that it?
Pretty much

www.arab-reform.net/publication/the-social-and-economic-cost-of-egypts-prison-system/

Egypt is considered one of the countries with high recidivism rates. According to a study conducted by the National Center for Social and Criminological Research in 2011, recidivism in released prisoners reached 34.6% — a very high percentage that clearly demonstrates the failure of the prison system to achieve its goals.
I think recidivism rates are a bit of a red herring here - we're talking about his political position. - but you asked.

I just don't believe him. I do not believe that level of sheer hatred can just disappear in a few years. I would need to see proof, in much the same way that a parole board needs to see proof of rehabilitation before they will release you (even though they get it wrong far too often for my liking)

El-Fattah is 44 years old (born in 1981)... when he was posting those Tweets from 2010 to 2013 he was 29 to 32 years old. That is a grown up. People of that age are very likely to have already formed the worldview they are likely to stay with for the rest of their lives. 29 to 32 years old is well past the angry youngster stage.
 
Irrelevant. She was given terrible advice by her lawyer. Ricky Jones (a Labour councillor) was recorded on video directly urging for throats to be cut, which is far worse than anything Connolly posted, and was found not guilty.
Is saying "set fire to all the ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ hotels full of the bastards for all I care" genuinely worse than someone saying "we need to cut all their throats and get rid of them all"?

They look like statements as bad as each other to me.

According to the [biased] BBC, in an article dated August 16th 2025 "Ricky Jones, 58, has been on trial at Snaresbrook Crown Court after he was seen on video making reference to "disgusting Nazi fascists" while addressing a crowd in Walthamstow on 7 August last year."

So that is about one year of legal process, and we all know that you claim that "the process is the punishment".

So why did Ricky Jones get off? According to the [biased] BBC:

"Mr Jones was arrested the day after making the comments and told the court he felt it was his "duty" to attend counter-protests.

Jurors deliberated for just over half an hour before finding him not guilty on Friday."

The jury found him not guilty.

So what is your theory of the case here, smartcooky?

Unless you think there is really a material difference between what Lucy Connolly and Ricky Jones said, you seem to be making the argument that Lucy Connolly's lawyers and Ricky Jones's jury are all part of some conspiracy to punish one group of people (Tories? White people?) and let another group of people off (Labour politicians? People not quite white enough for you?).

And please answer the question I asked you before. Do you think Lucy Connolly's tweet was an incitement to violence, yes or no?

Stop hiding and spit it out man!
 
He's had ten ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ years in an Egyptian prison. You don't think someone can change after that? Once a criminal, always a criminal, is that it?
My understanding is that Maajid Nawaz did. Although, he turned into an anti-vax freak afterwards, so the jury's out on that. LOL!

But anyway, I don't really think we should assume that he must have must not have turned over a new leaf.

I think a more plausible explanation, which is still pretty damning of both Tories and Labour, is that neither of the parties had properly vetted this guy which is pretty astonishing frankly.

Unlike smartcooky, I don't think Starmer is rubbing his hands in glee at the idea that he is importing some anti-semitic mastermind. I think the answer is that he's a bit dim, although probably not as dim as Liz Truss, who is suddenly hopping mad over this even though she was foreign minister when Alaa Abd el-Fattah was given citizenship, or Boris Johnson, who was prime minister.
 
Lets be clear here. Starmer bragged about bringing an openly pro-violence, pro-terrorist, anti-British, anti-White, racist anti-Semite into the UK, and none of you have expressed any real objection, so I have to take it that many of you are just fine with it. Starmer is now trying to claim he had no idea about El_Fattah's social media posts. But he is a liar.
He raised this very issue in Parliament three years ago when he was in Opposition!!
Do you have a citation for this?
 
Pretty much
I see.

I just don't believe him. I do not believe that level of sheer hatred can just disappear in a few years. I would need to see proof, in much the same way that a parole board needs to see proof of rehabilitation before they will release you (even though they get it wrong far too often for my liking)
What would that proof look like?

El-Fattah is 44 years old (born in 1981)... when he was posting those Tweets from 2010 to 2013 he was 29 to 32 years old. That is a grown up. People of that age are very likely to have already formed the worldview they are likely to stay with for the rest of their lives. 29 to 32 years old is well past the angry youngster stage.
Do you really think people can't change their views after the age of 32? I think that's extremely uncharitable of you. I know plenty of people who have changed significantly in their 30s, 40s, and 50s. Including me. Including you. I assume that you're not under 32. Apologies if you are.

Anyway, as far as I have seen in certain sectors of the Arab world, they say "death to Israel" the way we say "◊◊◊◊", with exactly the same level of commitment.
 
I see.


What would that proof look like?


Do you really think people can't change their views after the age of 32? I think that's extremely uncharitable of you. I know plenty of people who have changed significantly in their 30s, 40s, and 50s. Including me. Including you. I assume that you're not under 32. Apologies if you are.

Anyway, as far as I have seen in certain sectors of the Arab world, they say "death to Israel" the way we say "◊◊◊◊", with exactly the same level of commitment.
Anything smartcooky is saying about Alaa Abd el-Fattah is nothing but a distraction. It makes no sense for him to be complaining about a lack of freedom of speech in the UK by complaining that Alaa Abd el-Fattah is not being punished for his speech except as a smokescreen for Lucy Connolly, but smartcooky has not told us whether he agreees that her speech is incitement to violence.
 
...snip...

I think a more plausible explanation, which is still pretty damning of both Tories and Labour, is that neither of the parties had properly vetted this guy which is pretty astonishing frankly.

...snip....
This. I was surprised it only came to light when he was able to return to UK, it didn't come to light when he was released and not even when the right wing* were trying to get him back.

*I believe we now have to label everything as either right or left wing.
 
This. I was surprised it only came to light when he was able to return to UK, it didn't come to light when he was released and not even when the right wing* were trying to get him back.

*I believe we now have to label everything as either right or left wing.
No, I believe that the approved terms are "centrist" and "loony-lefty".
 
Instead of all the distractions, diversions, misdirections, whataboutisms, personal attacks and questioning of my political position, how about actually addressing the issue, which is....

On the one hand you have Lucy Connolly, who makes a SINGLE post in anger in a response to the Southport riots and the cold blooded murder of three little girls aged six, seven and nine. She thinks better of it and deletes it quickly. But not quickly enough - the ever watchful UK Thought Police know about it. She is arrested and charged with the offence of inciting racial hatred. Gets a 31 month prison sentence.

On the other hand you have Alaa Abd El-Fattah, posting dozens of posts over a period of four years, inciting and indeed, encouraging the murder of Jews, while males and policemen. Never regrets posting any of them - some of them are still up. These are in plain view of the UK Thought Police.... what happened to him? Nothing! Nada! El Zippo! He gets a free pass.


Do any of you agree with allowing this scumbag into the country? "Because he is a British Citizen" will be regarded as a cheap cop-out and will not be accepted as a valid answer. I want to know what YOU personally think, not what your echo-chamber tells you to think.

I know you won't. Not ONE of you lefties is at all interested in HONESTLY addressing such difficult issues - ones that challenge your belief systems.

The reason why Connolly was treated more severely than El-Fattah, is because the state fears crimes against itself, in particular, spreading national rioting, more than any crime against the individual or group in society. Throughout history, in every country in the world, the government and judiciary cracks down hard on those who riot, or incite riots, when rioting is spreading across the country.

Little local riots, that show no signs of spreading across the country, that can be contained by the police, courts and prisons, do not attract the same level of punishment. When riots show signs of becoming national, the courts in particular are very swift and punishing and imprisoning people to act as a deterrent to other prospective rioters. The publicity generated by jailing Connolly, is a deterrent, to stop the police, courts and prisons becoming totally overwhelmed, which the state fears more than anything else.

It has always been that way and at the last national riots in 2011, people got prison for incitement on social media, with the police and courts expressing concern about how easy it was to incite people online. Two males got 4 years for suggesting people meet at a fast food outlet and riot, and the only other people to turn up were the police, to arrest them. By 2025, people had forgotten all about that, or the excitement of a riot got the better of them, and they are now in serious trouble.

A little bit of research and you will find lots of instances of immediate and severe crack downs on rioters, from Peterloo in 1819 to George Square in 1919. What happened to Connolly, to anyone who has looked at how governments deal with national riots, understands that it is normal. By 2012, rioters from 2011 had been sent to prison for a total of over 1800 years and arrests were still being made.


In about 10 years time, when the UK next has a national riot, the same will happen again and people who do not bother to find out why, will get confused by the severe penalties for those who incite rioting.
 
The article makes a fundamental mistake about free speech Its not a problem, and its not illegal for

- Individuals like Charlie Kirk or Ben Shapiro, Joy Reid or Owen Jones to shout down down opponents.
- Companies to limit what their employees are allowed to say about them.
- Social Media companies to limit what you can say on their platforms.

Its best illustrated by this XKCD...

free_speech4-non-US.png


It ONLY becomes an issue when the GOVERNMENT starts to do it.
 
So everything not illegal is perfectly acceptable? What about those consequences Randall is talking about? Why should there be consequences if it's "not a problem"?
There are plenty of things that are not morally acceptable, in my opinion, but which should nevertheless be legally acceptable.

Things which should not be legally acceptable are direct calls for violence or threats. This is why I keep asking smartcooky about Lucy Connolly's actual tweet. He has clearly blocked me because he hasn't answered my questions about it. Instead he characterizes her words as:

a hurty tweet with "anti-immigrant sentiment",

It is NOT a "hurty tweet" with "anti-immigrant sentiment". She says "set fire to all the ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ hotels full of the bastards".

Could someone directly point this out to smartcooky, please!
 
It is NOT a "hurty tweet" with "anti-immigrant sentiment". She says "set fire to all the ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ hotels full of the bastards".
And the context, which @smartcooky has not presented, is that she tweeted it during an anti-immigrant riot where rioters were trying to set fire to hotels with immigrants in them. She knew this, as the judge found, and said it anyway, and it was viewed by 300,000 people.

I learned this by listening to The Know Rogan Experience podcast, where two well-known skeptics from either side of the pond tear into and comprehensively break down the lies, conspiracy theories, and mis/disinformation that Joe Rogan spreads and promotes on the biggest podcast platform in the world.
 
And the context, which @smartcooky has not presented, is that she tweeted it during an anti-immigrant riot where rioters were trying to set fire to hotels with immigrants in them. She knew this, as the judge found, and said it anyway, and it was viewed by 300,000 people.

I learned this by listening to The Know Rogan Experience podcast, where two well-known skeptics from either side of the pond tear into and comprehensively break down the lies, conspiracy theories, and mis/disinformation that Joe Rogan spreads and promotes on the biggest podcast platform in the world.
Sure, but it was well-known to people in the UK at the time. smartcooky should try to research what happened instead of parroting talking points from his echo chamber.
 

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