• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Cont: Musk, SpaceX and future of Tesla II

arthwollipot said:
Unless you go to https://www.tesla.com/en_au where you'll find plenty of them.
Click to expand...
We already mentioned upthread that yes. Tesla has a ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ of them new sitting around unsold lol
Or you can if you are so inclined, go to any of the secondhand car sites, there's tons more of them sitting there too lol

And that their sales are well down on 2024 and even more on 2023, despite the new models and slashing the price to boot....

The whole 'the owner is a fascist AH' thing is unsurprisingly a major turnoff for many, plus they are easily the most expensive to buy in any class, and repairs are both expensive and take a LONG time to complete (or even start lol) with delays of six months or more not uncommon before repairs are done....

In 2025 Tesla were well down in the new cars sales overall, at 13th, while BYD came in at number 6... (and considering that BYD only sell BEV and a hybrid 4wd Shark 6 ute or Sealion 6 SUV.... no pure ICE at all, coming in at number 6 overall is pretty bloody good indeed....)
1765516967308.png
In the pure EV sales, they were very close, with Tesla ever so slightly in front (by about 3000 cars), but including the sales of the hybrid's and BYD slaughtered Tesla, moving 42 thousand BEV and PHEV against Teslas total sales of just over 25 thousand....
 
Dabop said:
Same with Australia (hell its the same worldwide) the US sales drop is less than most other countries though- outing yourself as a fascist racist prick in the US is these days 'so what' while in TROTW, its still a big thing to be one....
In Australia their sales are down in 2025 for the yearly total 25% compared to 2023...

And thats with both 'new and updated' models being released in 2025, as well as substantial price drops for both the new and the old models!!!! with the new ones down 10% in price or more compared to the old ones price in 2023...
And yet their sales numbers are still plummeting....

Who knew outing yourself as a far rightwing fascist could be so expensive lol
View attachment 66990

This was far from the ONLY thing that he was doing that was fascist, it was just the most noticeable....
People were saying it long before he did his 'salute'...
Click to expand...
I know they refreshed the model 3 Y but I was unaware that Tesla had released any new models in 2025.
 
Last edited:
jeremyp said:
I know they refreshed the model 3 Y but I was unaware that Tesla had released any new models in 2025.
Click to expand...

No new models per sè , still just the S, 3, X, Y and CyberTruck.

Just variations on those models - stripped versions and a mildly stretched Y for China.

They’re all decent cars, save maybe the CyberTruck, but starting to feel a little stale. Such that current owners like myself, see little reason to purchase a newer model, even after almost 4 years and over 87,000 miles on our 2022 Model 3.
 
it’s a more basic base model. which imo is more sensible to buy, as a guy who has never bought new or for luxury. but i’d also never buy a tesla, purely because i think musk is a crook and a bad guy
 
Well in Australia, forget the dumpstertruck- it hasn't passed the Australian safety standards testing on at least two attempts (and I doubt it ever would without a ground up rebuild/redesign...)- theres very few countries it will ever be sold in...
The only available Tesla models here are the Model 3, Model Y, Model S, and Model X. The Model 3 and Model Y are the only ones that are sold in any numbers however, with the 3's sales well down compared to 2024, down by over 60% with them selling only 6030 for 2025!!!!
The Model Y did better with just under 18000- still well down on the previous year where they sold just over 21000...
The S and X did very poorly this year indeed- with none sold at all....- at least they sold a handful in 2024 lol
 
jeremyp said:
Agreed.



Well no. The Tesla board recommended the package to the shareholders and they voted for it. That suggests that the thing they are uneasy about is Musk losing interest in running Tesla.



The problem is that his wealth is not liquid. It mostly consists of shares in Tesla and SpaceX. If he tries to sell Tesla shares, the price gores down which reduces the value of the rest of his holding and that is important because he uses his stock as collateral for bank loans. If the price goes too low (about $100 according to some estimates) he will be subject to margin calls i.e. the banks will ask him to put up more collateral or pay down some of his debt. He can't sell his SpaceX shares, at least not on the open market because SpaceX is a private company. So he doesn't have as much money as it might seem looking at his headline valuation.

From Musk's point of view the IPO has a couple of downsides: it slightly dilutes his control (they are only selling 2%, so not much) and it makes SpaceX subject to the rules of a public company. They have to publish their accounts and obey tedious rules that Musk doesn't like. I don't think SpaceX would be doing this if they didn't need the money.

I think this is purely about developing Starship. They have a $3 billion contract with NASA to build the HLS and I think they have used all that money up. I don't think SpaceX's other projects (Falcon 9 and Starlink) produce nearly enough - if any - profit to cover the expenses incurred on Starship so far.
Click to expand...
My guess is either a) the VC money for Space X has dried up (quite likely given so much of this money is tied up in AI and not performing) or b) Musk has been told the writing's on the wall for Tesla and to get out while the going's still (relatively) good.
 
Gulliver Foyle said:
My guess is either a) the VC money for Space X has dried up (quite likely given so much of this money is tied up in AI and not performing) or b) Musk has been told the writing's on the wall for Tesla and to get out while the going's still (relatively) good.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure it's the former. I think Starship is sucking all the spare cash out of SpaceX and they can't cancel it because they'd have to give the HLS money back to NASA which they haven't got anymore. Also, I don't think Starlink is long term viable without a cheaper launch system than Falcon 9.

One of the positive things about this is that we might get to see some P&L figures.
 
jeremyp said:
I'm pretty sure it's the former. I think Starship is sucking all the spare cash out of SpaceX and they can't cancel it because they'd have to give the HLS money back to NASA which they haven't got anymore. Also, I don't think Starlink is long term viable without a cheaper launch system than Falcon 9.

One of the positive things about this is that we might get to see some P&L figures.
Click to expand...
The main reason for Starlink's existence is to fabricate a market for the Falcon 9. If the Falcon programme hadn't been started there would have been no need to create a company that shoots a lot of small and short-life satellites into space.
 
Gulliver Foyle said:
The main reason for Starlink's existence is to fabricate a market for the Falcon 9. If the Falcon programme hadn't been started there would have been no need to create a company that shoots a lot of small and short-life satellites into space.
Click to expand...
In fact, Starlink has been extremely successful at bringing Internet connectivity into remote areas where satellite coverage was previously expensive and unreliable.

Astronomers hate it though. Too much clutter in the skies.
 
Gulliver Foyle said:
The main reason for Starlink's existence is to fabricate a market for the Falcon 9. If the Falcon programme hadn't been started there would have been no need to create a company that shoots a lot of small and short-life satellites into space.
Click to expand...
It is also going to need Starship hitting its goal in costs for launching satellites to maintain the network and make money, it's too expensive to keep using Falcon launches. Although Starlink is apparently now profitable that's only after very, very expensive capital costs that probably will never be recouped.
 

patrick boyle breakdown on how badly of a failure doge was. it’s a shame this just happened and how readily it was swept under the rug.

musk is a grifting con man, and idk how many times he needs to show that for everyone to get it. again and again.
 
dirtywick said:
patrick boyle breakdown on how badly of a failure doge was. it’s a shame this just happened and how readily it was swept under the rug.

musk is a grifting con man, and idk how many times he needs to show that for everyone to get it. again and again.
Click to expand...
My really, really short summary for those who don't feel like watching - DOGE destroyed lots of value, lied like crazy about the amount and nature of the tiny "savings" that they actually accomplished, caused large numbers of deaths and extreme losses of national soft power, and was generally (ridiculously) bad enough in enough different ways that it could be used to write a textbook on how not to do its stated good goal of increasing government efficiency with lots of actual examples of how they did things that anyone with even a hint of common sense can easily see to be ridiculous.

◊◊◊◊ Musk, the murderous conman. ◊◊◊◊ all his enablers, too.
 
Last edited:
arthwollipot said:
In fact, Starlink has been extremely successful at bringing Internet connectivity into remote areas where satellite coverage was previously expensive and unreliable.

Astronomers hate it though. Too much clutter in the skies.
Click to expand...
It depends what you mean by "successful". It works on a technical level but we don't know if it is sustainable i.e. if it covers its costs. Because Starlink is launched on rockets owned by SpaceX, there is plenty of opportunity for creative accounting and Musk himself said in an email to SpaceX staff in 2021 that if they didn't get Starship operational next year (2022), Starlink might drag the company down.

Of course, it was Elon Musk who said that and he was trying to bully his employees into giving up their Thanksgiving holiday, so it might have been a lie, but Starlink has other problems, not least of which is that they effectively have to replace the satellite constellation every five years or so. Also, it can't be made competitive in areas which have reasonable broadband, so the market is limited and shrinking all the time as more people move to urban areas and the reach of ground based fibre and 5G increases.

Anyway, we'll find out if Starlink is sustainable when SpaceX goes public.
 
dirtywick said:
patrick boyle breakdown on how badly of a failure doge was. it’s a shame this just happened and how readily it was swept under the rug.
Click to expand...
Nonsense! DOGE's chaos goblin antics might seem random and ineffectual but it accomplished exactly what it set out to do: provide cover for large scale theft of government data, burn down every active investigation into Elon Musk's business practices, then evaporate like a fart in the wind without leaving a paper trail to anyone important. Twenty year old patsy douchebags who get their ass kicked by children don't count.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom