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Trump's Second Term

That can't be right, Elon says more people are claiming than there are people in the USA. Billions and billions of dollars in fraud!
 
Marco Rubio says America is the first power in history motivated by a desire to expand freedom rather than its own territory.

Canada, Greenland, Denmark, Panama, and Gaza could not immediately be reached for comment.

Not to forget Louisiana Purchase, Alaska and, Hawaii
 
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Tero said:
A tax cut cannot reduce debt.
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Ehh. Technically, it can. It's just that in practice, 1) the taxes would need to be outright ruinous to start with and/or 2) the taxes in question would actually need to be used to deal with the debt. Neither is in play here, of course. Taxes aren't even remotely ruinous. They're likely far too low on the rich, for that matter. Republicans will also be continuing to try to give the rich more money and completely ignoring the debt in practice, as they consistently do, for all their pretending to care about the debt.

Orphia Nay said:
AOC did a thing recently about practical steps how to help immigrants.
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Not quite. The thing in question is that AOC did a thing about educating immigrants on what rights they actually have. No surprise that the Trump Administration would absolutely hate that. She was already a prime target because the Republican Party hates and feels threatened by strong, popular Democratic women that actually work to uplift the country, so this was a bit of a twofer.
 
Aridas said:
Ehh. Technically, it can. It's just that in practice, 1) the taxes would need to be outright ruinous to start with and/or 2) the taxes in question would actually need to be used to deal with the debt. Neither is in play here, of course. Taxes aren't even remotely ruinous. They're likely far too low on the rich, for that matter. Republicans will also be continuing to try to give the rich more money and completely ignoring the debt in practice, as they consistently do, for all their pretending to care about the debt.



Not quite. The thing in question is that AOC did a thing about educating immigrants on what rights they actually have. No surprise that the Trump Administration would absolutely hate that. She was already a prime target because the Republican Party hates and feels threatened by strong, popular Democratic women that actually work to uplift the country, so this was a bit of a twofer.
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I personally think the end game is to make the national debt so outrageously high that no one has a choice but to cut back on or eliminate entirely the social programs that help people, but that's just my opinion.

Your mileage may vary of course.


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Aridas said:
Ehh. Technically, it can. It's just that in practice, 1) the taxes would need to be outright ruinous to start with and/or 2) the taxes in question would actually need to be used to deal with the debt. Neither is in play here, of course. Taxes aren't even remotely ruinous. They're likely far too low on the rich, for that matter. Republicans will also be continuing to try to give the rich more money and completely ignoring the debt in practice, as they consistently do, for all their pretending to care about the debt.
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Wouldn't that require a hike, rather than a cut?
 
crescent said:
Just got back. It wasn't huge, but seemed well attended. Never got above about 25 degrees f. There were some speeches I couldn't hear and then a march around downtown and back to the state capital. As we were arriving, some were already leaving, and as we were leaving a few hours later, many were still arriving. I think a lot of people came but didn't stay long because of the cold, just a constant stream of coming and going and coming and going.

No hints of violence or vandalism. Very little police presence except right around the capital building. And handful of masked activists in black, but they seemed subdued and quiet.

The organizers seem to be an old school communist labor group. Lots of chants about immigration, Black Lives Matter, anti-Elon Musk, anti-Trump. Nothing about federal employees or federal lands from the organizers, although many of the signs mentioned federal workers, DOGE, and some mention of federal lands. I think the alliance of old-school anti-establishment leftists and federal employees/advocates (perceived to be the establishment) is a match made in a political sausage-making factory, but it can work.

Here's a link to a vid of the march portion. Not my vid, but gives some idea of the crowd size. I might be in the frame in the first second of the video, we sort of accidentally ended up near the front of the march. https://bsky.app/profile/hughgraham.bsky.social/post/3lifpayaq2c2w
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They were certainly in a hurry to get wherever they were going!
 
crescent said:
No hints of violence or vandalism. Very little police presence except right around the capital building. And handful of masked activists in black, but they seemed subdued and quiet.
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That's good to hear, but the "masked" activist is the same description given to the police of those who started the violence during Trump's Innauguration party in 2017.

In the violence, knots of activists in black clothes and masks threw rocks and bottles at officers wearing riot gear, who responded with volleys of tear gas and stun grenades as a helicopter hovered low overhead.
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FROM: https://www.reuters.com/article/wor...gton-during-trump-inauguration-idUSKBN1550CW/


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AmyStrange said:
I personally think the end game is to make the national debt so outrageously high that no one has a choice but to cut back on or eliminate entirely the social programs that help people, but that's just my opinion.
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That is what the Republican Two Santa Clauses strategy that Republicans have been using since Reagan is pretty much all about, after all. There's a bit more nuance, of course, but it's all about screwing with the debt to justify eliminating social programs and gaining political advantage in the process.

Silly Green Monkey said:
Wouldn't that require a hike, rather than a cut?
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Getting more money to the rich? Depends how over the top greedy they think they can get away with. Tax cuts for the rich are much easier to sell when the poor also think they're getting a couple pennies, too. Project 2025, of course, proposed effectively raising taxes for the bottom 90% or so in what they proposed for their massive tax cuts for the top couple percent.
 
It seemed you responded to Tero's statement that tax cuts cannot reduce debt as though you thought it had been that tax hikes cannot reduce debt.
 
Silly Green Monkey said:
It seemed you responded to Tero's statement that tax cuts cannot reduce debt as though you thought it had been that tax hikes cannot reduce debt.
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I'm... not sure how it can be taken that way. I pointed out the theoretical conditions where a tax cut could potentially reduce debt - excessively high taxes can actually reduce the total taxes collected, after all, and if tax cuts were tied to increased focus on actually reducing debts, that could easily help address the debts. I followed that up with agreement that those aren't in play here, though.
 
Ziggurat said:
I don't even disagree. But the thing is, Trump isn't a standard Republican. In fact, a very significant component of the Republican opposition to Trump comes from the fact that he threatens to disrupt their gravy train. The fact that prior Republicans have also been bad on the budget isn't an argument in favor of Democrats. None of the current Democrats have anything like Bill Clinton's fiscal responsibility.
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Trump isn't any sort of a Republican. He's in it for one thing, himself. That's all his personality is capable of. His actions are only about what brings him attention, adulation and wealth. In return her demands total loyalty.

He actually ran a scam coin while running for office.
 
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Elon knows why there are so many complaints about his investigating entitlements.

Elon Musk
@elonmusk

The REAL reason so many Democrats are upset about entitlements (social security, medical, etc) fraud investigations is that they are using your taxpayer money as handouts to attract and retain ILLEGAL immigrants. Their future voters.
That’s what it’s all about.

Truth.
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AmyStrange said:
I personally think the end game is to make the national debt so outrageously high that no one has a choice but to cut back on or eliminate entirely the social programs that help people, but that's just my opinion.

Your mileage may vary of course.


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But really, would it make sense to do that?

I don't mean as a by-product of over-promising, which is certainly possible.

But what would be the point of saying "Hey let's eliminate programs that help people just for the hell of it. I know, let's deliberately run up the national debt to such an extent that everyone will say we have no choice but to cut back on social programs."

What is more likely is just that they keep their rich base happy in the short term with tax cuts, and keep the poorer supporters happy with social programs.

Of course that is unsustainable, but not for the purpose of deliberately cutting programs that would upset the poor. It makes no sense to do that.
 
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