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US Air Force removes lessons on black WWII pilots from training

And the usual suspects remain dead silent. Or until they can muster a "we would discuss this but you just want to mock conservatives nonsense".
 
The Don said:
I look forward to seeing how slavery will be reinterpreted - a skills acquisition programme for immigrants from developing countries in Africa perhaps.
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Well we already have Florida being sure to teach about the benefits of slavery to the slaves. So yes pretty much exactly that.
 
Vixen said:
In President Trump's mission to remove all DEI initiatives, this is the latest to be taken down.
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I see you're already aware that this has been reversed. But you may still not understand what probably happened here. And what probably happened here is that some lower level bureaucrats who don't like the removal of DEI decided to try some malicious compliance, by going overboard and trying to make Trump and Hegseth look bad. And at least at first, it worked, because this was portrayed by the press as something Trump did, and not as something some low level bureaucrat did. As has been correctly pointed out by others, the history video in question isn't DEI. It didn't need to be removed from the curriculum. Anyone with a working brain could figure that out. And the people who decided to remove it probably did figure it out, and removed it anyways.

We can expect to see a lot more of this sort of bureaucratic sabotage attempt.
 
Ziggurat said:
I see you're already aware that this has been reversed. But you may still not understand what probably happened here. And what probably happened here is that some lower level bureaucrats who don't like the removal of DEI decided to try some malicious compliance, by going overboard and trying to make Trump and Hegseth look bad. And at least at first, it worked, because this was portrayed by the press as something Trump did, and not as something some low level bureaucrat did. As has been correctly pointed out by others, the history video in question isn't DEI. It didn't need to be removed from the curriculum. Anyone with a working brain could figure that out. And the people who decided to remove it probably did figure it out, and removed it anyways.

We can expect to see a lot more of this sort of bureaucratic sabotage attempt.
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The thing is, whilst Trump issued a DEI EO ordering an immediate review of DEI stuff, the US Airforce had to be seen to promptly obey as the directive also made it an offence to fail to do so. So whilst it could be argued some zealot for whatever reason withdrew the Tuskegee Airmen and WASP's training videos/materials, whether because they were glad to 'get rid of woke' or because they were unsure or even because they wanted to cause an anti-DEI controversy knowing it would cause anger, nonetheless discretion was probably the better part of valour by whoever made the decision to take it down. Hegseth might well have realised the reputation damage this action was causing despite being an avid supporter of Trump's anti-woke nonsense and has done an about face before things got out of hand. Especially with the international press reporting on it.
 
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Vixen said:
Hegseth might well have realised the reputation damage this action was causing despite being an avid supporter of Trump's anti-woke nonsense and has done an about face before things got out of hand. Especially with the international press reporting on it.
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Hegseth didn't do an about face. That's the point. He reversed what some lower level bureaucrats did, but what they did isn't in line with Hegseth or Trump or the anti-DEI push. Perhaps you're not aware, but during his first term, Trump promoted Col. Charles E. McGee, one of the Tuskegee airmen, to brigadier general at a White House ceremony. He didn't have to do that. Obama didn't do that. Trump did it because he wanted to.

This was similar to malicious compliance, except it wasn't actually compliance, making it more like malicious misinterpretation.
 
Ziggurat said:
Hegseth didn't do an about face. That's the point. He reversed what some lower level bureaucrats did, but what they did isn't in line with Hegseth or Trump or the anti-DEI push. Perhaps you're not aware, but during his first term, Trump promoted Col. Charles E. McGee, one of the Tuskegee airmen, to brigadier general at a White House ceremony. He didn't have to do that. Obama didn't do that. Trump did it because he wanted to.

This was similar to malicious compliance, except it wasn't actually compliance, making it more like malicious misinterpretation.
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I can't see how Trump promoting Col. Charles E. McGee, one of the Tuskegee airmen, to brigadier general at a White House ceremony indicates anything. At his inauguration ceremony Trump took a moment to say how much he loved the Latin and Black population yet in the next breath he declared all the DEI initiatives immediately abolished and DEI staff put on full paid leave 'by 5:00pm' the day after.

All these people he loves so much: redundant, just like that!
 
Vixen said:
I can't see how Trump promoting Col. Charles E. McGee, one of the Tuskegee airmen, to brigadier general at a White House ceremony indicates anything. At his inauguration ceremony Trump took a moment to say how much he loved the Latin and Black population yet in the next breath he declared all the DEI initiatives immediately abolished and DEI staff put on full paid leave 'by 5:00pm' the day after.

All these people he loves so much: redundant, just like that!
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Are you under the impression that DEI is synonymous with anti-discrimination? It isn't. The entire point of DEI is discrimination. If you think blacks, hispanics, and women need discrimination in their favor in order to succeed in life, I can see why getting rid of DEI might bother you. But if you don't think that, if you think blacks and hispanics and women are competent people who aren't rendered "redundant" by having to compete on a level playing field, then the demise of DEI isn't really a problem.
 
They made the decision because it doesn't fit into the White Supremacist narrative. Only white men are capable, any facts that show otherwise are banned.
 
Ziggurat said:
Are you under the impression that DEI is synonymous with anti-discrimination? It isn't. The entire point of DEI is discrimination. If you think blacks, hispanics, and women need discrimination in their favor in order to succeed in life, I can see why getting rid of DEI might bother you. But if you don't think that, if you think blacks and hispanics and women are competent people who aren't rendered "redundant" by having to compete on a level playing field, then the demise of DEI isn't really a problem.
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Does anyone want to tell him? I mean, I know Zigg knows that it isn't, and hasn't been, a level playing field ever. I wonder if he knows that being disingenuous isn't fooling anyone. Seriously, no one falls for this ◊◊◊◊ around here. Why even bother?
 
Ziggurat said:
Are you under the impression that DEI is synonymous with anti-discrimination? It isn't. The entire point of DEI is discrimination. If you think blacks, hispanics, and women need discrimination in their favor in order to succeed in life, I can see why getting rid of DEI might bother you. But if you don't think that, if you think blacks and hispanics and women are competent people who aren't rendered "redundant" by having to compete on a
level playing field, then the demise of DEI isn't really a problem.
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The reason for DEI is that the playing field isn't level. DEI delivers equity, not equality. Just look at the Presidency, the only President of colour wasn't from an African American family. No women, no hispanics, no asians, no native americans.
 
I think everyone gets it. Positive discrimination is discrimination. Look how virtuous we are sweeping away discrimination.
 
Ziggurat said:
Are you under the impression that DEI is synonymous with anti-discrimination? It isn't. The entire point of DEI is discrimination. If you think blacks, hispanics, and women need discrimination in their favor in order to succeed in life, I can see why getting rid of DEI might bother you. But if you don't think that, if you think blacks and hispanics and women are competent people who aren't rendered "redundant" by having to compete on a level playing field, then the demise of DEI isn't really a problem.
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That is an interesting and complex question. I don't know much about how DEI works in the USA but in the UK there is a misconception amongst those against them that it gives special favour to minority groups but in fact, that is incorrect (although there might special projects in some areas, for example, projects specifically for the disabled): you are not allowed to discriminate against any group, which includes favouring one group over another. Exceptions are private clubs and schools of a religious denomination [but even then they can fall foul].

I do get the impression that Trump wants to ditch the DEI initiatives because (a) it was a Biden one and (b) he probably erroneously believes the DEI groups included are being postively discriminated in their favour to the detriment of 'people more deserving/able/better experienced'.

My perception of Trump is as of a 12-year-old mentality as in his ridiculous claims certain groups were eating cats and dogs. In other words his measures are vindictive and low-IQ rather than any concern that 'everyone should have the same playing field'. I note there is an argument he is not going after the Irish population in Boston where someone is claiming there are plenty of undocumented white guys, too, but they are not being targetted. So yes, it does come across as a programme of persecution not dissimilar to Hitler's, especially with outed racist Elon Musk stating at an AfD rally his fear of 'German blood' being diluted. Whilst Musk is a card carrying far right racist, I think Trump is more of the low-IQ type; wants to be loved and no doubt has plenty of friends of all races, but at the same time is paranoid about being invaded by 'them', and works himself up into quite a rage about it.
 
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White Supremacy, that's why they are banning DEI initiatives. No other explanations are needed.
 
Vixen said:
That is an interesting and complex question. I don't know much about how DEI works in the USA but in the UK there is a misconception amongst those against them that it gives special favour to minority groups but in fact, that is incorrect
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That is explicitly what DEI in the US does. That is the entire point. That is what distinguishes it from traditional anti-discrimination that arose from the civil rights movement of the 1960's. None of your conclusions about DEI, and what it means to get rid of it, are in any way valid because of this fundamental misunderstanding of what it is and what it does.
Vixen said:
My perception of Trump is as of a 12-year-old mentality
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I'm not really interested in debating your perception of Trump. I'll just note that you seem to be drawing conclusions about other things based on your perception of Trump himself. This is probably not the best way to evaluate policy.
 
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