The Rise of Hitler and The Age of Trump: A Comparison

[TurkeysGhost]

But Trump isn't the problem: he's the result. Look at the kinds of Republicans who are being elected in the red states. Republicans aren't voting for more moderate legislators, they're voting in more radical ones who are more competent like Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz or even crazier like MTG and Boebert. They aren't 'dispersing' at all. Trump supporters will get behind whatever far right candidate echos Trump which is why they are all kneeling before him at Mar a Lago.

Yes. I see a lot of anti-Trump people seeming to think that our troubles are over, and even mocking the parade of wackadoos that are starting to fill in the Right wing rosters.

Our failed coup wasn't a total waste for the extreme right in this country. A failure still contains useful data. They learned that many cops really aren't willing to oppose fascist violence, even in the case of a physical attack on the seats of power. They also learned where the vulnerabilities of our political system lies.

These absurd "investigations" into elections in places like Arizona are no laughing matter. It doesn't matter that it's false. The right has correctly determined that, so long as they sufficiently ideological allies in the right positions, they can overturn losing elections and install a minoritarian president. The handful of Republican officials that did their duty and refused to be cowed by Trump are well on their way to being cast out and replaced with more loyal types.

The next time around there could easily be a contested election where extreme right secretaries of state or other officials just dismiss a losing election as invalid. Do we really think Republicans in Congress won't jump on an opportunity to claim a "contested" election means their guy won?

We're witnessing within the right wing a thorough purge of anyone with any scrap of scruples. Those that refused to play along with the self-serving lies of election fraud are being shown the door. Next time around there won't be any wishy washy types in the way.

The path forward for American fascism is pretty clear.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

But Trump isn't the problem: he's the result. Look at the kinds of Republicans who are being elected in the red states. Republicans aren't voting for more moderate legislators, they're voting in more radical ones who are more competent like Josh Hawley and Ted Cruz or even crazier like MTG and Boebert. They aren't 'dispersing' at all. Trump supporters will get behind whatever far right candidate echos Trump which is why they are all kneeling before him at Mar a Lago.

The result or not, without another cult leader the movement of rightwing radicals can follow, they will remain disorganized malcontents.

At this point in time, no way are those legislators capable of attracting and commanding a following.

 

[Bob001]

While it is true that there are some similarities between Trump and Hitler, but there are also a number of considerable differences between Trump and Hitler. As a result, I do not find that comparing Trump and Hitler does much good.
....

I don't think the real comparison is between the two men, but the movements that supported them. Both are anti-democratic, authoritarian and racist. Trump pretty clearly saw himself as an entertainer, and by multiple accounts he expected his campaign to help boost his brand and his TV properties, not to make him President. He shaped his message to appeal to the people who already felt that way, and in turn they have used him to seize and expand their power.

 

[Bob001]

The result or not, without another cult leader the movement of rightwing radicals can follow, they will remain disorganized malcontents.

At this point in time, no way are those legislators capable of attracting and commanding a following.

But they're not disorganized. The voting restrictions that numerous legislatures are considering and some have passed, and a lot of other right-wing laws and policies are coming directly from ALEC and other right-wing organizations. The Federalist Society was telling Trump who to put on the courts. Repub legislators don't have to win a big following as long as they can gerrymander their districts and decide who gets to vote.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Legislative_Exchange_Council

 

[Crossbow]

I don't think the real comparison is between the two men, but the movements that supported them. Both are anti-democratic, authoritarian and racist. Trump pretty clearly saw himself as an entertainer, and by multiple accounts he expected his campaign to help boost his brand and his TV properties, not to make him President. He shaped his message to appeal to the people who already felt that way, and in turn they have used him to seize and expand their power.

Thanks much and quite well said.

If nothing else, Trump is total opportunist, and once he got into power, he quickly used that for his own benefit. And of course, many of his supporters did much the same thing.

 

[Stacyhs]

I don't think the real comparison is between the two men, but the movements that supported them. Both are anti-democratic, authoritarian and racist. Trump pretty clearly saw himself as an entertainer, and by multiple accounts he expected his campaign to help boost his brand and his TV properties, not to make him President. He shaped his message to appeal to the people who already felt that way, and in turn they have used him to seize and expand their power.

Exactly. I did not title this thread "Hitler and Trump: A Comparison" for a reason. It's not about the two men. It's about how they came to power.

 

[Stacyhs]

I get the feeling that some of you have not actually read the article I linked to in my first post. Please do. It's not that long.

 

[JoeMorgue]

I get the feeling that some of you have not actually read the article I linked to in my first post. Please do. It's not that long.

It's also not that original.

Hitler/Trump thinkpieces from a billion different angles have a dime a dozen for years now, and that's not to say they are wrong but this isn't exactly news to most of us.

 

[TurkeysGhost]

It's also not that original.

Hitler/Trump thinkpieces from a billion different angles have a dime a dozen for years now, and that's not to say they are wrong but this isn't exactly news to most of us.

Especially at this point. There was a time when many people where willing to quibble about whether or not MAGA was a fascist movement, and in such cases historical precedent is useful for definition and comparison.

Does anyone really doubt this basic fact anymore?

 

[JoeMorgue]

Does anyone really doubt this basic fact anymore?

Not really. The only point of contention is internet trolls deciding that comparisons and metaphors and other forms of argumentative language are suddenly "bad" after being used with zero issue for all of human history because hate ******* the discussion hoping to kill it is all they have left after rejecting facts and basic human decency.

 

[abaddon]

Both are Jewish in their bloodlines on both sides .

Nope. Unlike the events of 70 years ago, people are reluctant to open open up an new Sobibor, or Treblinka or indulge such nonsense.

Bloodlines? That is such bovine crapology that it is to laugh. Bloodlines? Mine is far more ancient than yours. As if that matters to anyone.

But you seem to think that is important for some reason.

Before a brain collapse over that assertion about Adolf , read Miles Mathis' reports on the matter .

Mathis is a strung out surfer. Why would anyone pay any attention to his strung out ravings?

Trump's genealogy is well known and public .
The details and back- up scholarship are immense and it is pointless disagreeing until you have read the 'dossier '

Yup. Drumpf is a jew. Didn't you pay attention?

You will need to read it a few times to absorb, and disagreeing with it would require a few month's work at minimum and the scope of one or more books to cover it completely .

Nope. I need nothing much to observe a narcissist Jew. Why that is even vaguely relevant? There are narcissistic muslims who were quite happy to kill NYC, but you are not condemning those, are you.

Of course Compliance Gullibles will reject it before they get to paragraph two but information like this is not suitable for them in the first place .Something about thirsty horses and water -----

Interesting. Why do you support the supremacy of Islam?

 

[BobTheCoward]

I'm not sure it is a useful argument

Hitler learned his lesson: A sophisticated modern state could not be overturned by a violent coup led by outsiders, against the police and the army. He realized he would have to work within the system.

That applies to anyone trying to work within the system....liberals/conservatives/centrists/etc. The only ones not like Hitler are actual terrorists.

 

[Belz...]

Especially at this point. There was a time when many people where willing to quibble about whether or not MAGA was a fascist movement, and in such cases historical precedent is useful for definition and comparison.

Does anyone really doubt this basic fact anymore?

Don't insult the patriots, you dirty communist!!!

 

[Stacyhs]

Especially at this point. There was a time when many people where willing to quibble about whether or not MAGA was a fascist movement, and in such cases historical precedent is useful for definition and comparison.

Does anyone really doubt this basic fact anymore?

Isn't there an entire thread devoted to that very question? Why, yes...yes, there and it ran for 25 pages of people arguing :

Are we allowed to call Trump's regime fascism now?

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=345789


I'd say you'd get a pretty strong push back from the entire Republican Party that the MAGA movement is a fascist movement. They'd be wrong, of course, but you'd still get the argument.

 

[BobTheCoward]

I would like to point out that any fascist country or group we can all agree on labeled themselves fascist.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

But they're not disorganized. The voting restrictions that numerous legislatures are considering and some have passed, and a lot of other right-wing laws and policies are coming directly from ALEC and other right-wing organizations. The Federalist Society was telling Trump who to put on the courts. Repub legislators don't have to win a big following as long as they can gerrymander their districts and decide who gets to vote.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Legislative_Exchange_Council

You are conflating GOP power grabs/greed with an organized movement following a cult leader.

I think we're on two different tracks here.

 

[Stacyhs]

You are conflating GOP power grabs/greed with an organized movement following a cult leader.

I think we're on two different tracks here.

The GOP leadership is using the existence of the voter Cult of Trump in order to grab that power.

 

[newyorkguy]

That goes back to the atomization of the media. It wasn't all that long ago that most of us got most of our information about the world from the network news broadcasts and the local daily paper. You didn't have to like it, but everybody shared the same fact base...

Remember the 'information revolution?' We should have been careful about what we wished for, because as it turned out, we got it. And then some. (There were those who thought they saw this coming and tried to sound the alarm.)

 

[Belz...]

Remember the 'information revolution?' We should have been careful about what we wished for, because as it turned out, we got it. And then some. (There were those who thought they saw this coming and tried to sound the alarm.)

Well don't forget the good guys on the news also.

But I think in general the information revolution is a good thing. The main problem is that crazy people now have a bullhorn that reaches around the world. We're still in the infancy of that technology. With some luck we'll find a way to disseminate reliable information more consistently.

 

[Thermal]

....Mathis is a strung out surfer....

Hey hey hey. Surfers can write some truly beautiful prose. Miles From Sanity Mathis is a sad enough joke. Don't associate the boardriding community with that kook.