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For the neoconservatives who want Progressives to "form their own party,":

Trakar

Penultimate Amazing
Trakar
Joined
Oct 20, 2007
Messages
12,637
Be careful what you wish for!

As Tensions Simmer, Poll Shows Majority of Democrats Want Bold Leftward Shift

https://www.commondreams.org/news/2...s-majority-democrats-want-bold-leftward-shift

The survey suggests Democratic voters want to ditch the current party leadership and embrace the grassroots

Amid an ongoing battle within the Democratic National Committee between its progressive wing and the more "centrist" establishment, a Harvard-Harris poll (pdf - http://harvardharrispoll.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/HCAPS-October_Topline-Memo_with-banners_Registered-Voters_Current-Events.pdf) published Tuesday found that a majority of Democrats think their party should be embracing grassroots movements, ditching its current leadership, and moving to the left.
(...)
Desire for a leftward move was strongest among young Democrats, who overwhelmingly backed Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) in the 2016 Democratic primary.

The Harvard-Harris poll found that 69 percent of Democratic voters between the ages of 18 and 34 believe the party should embrace the leftward shift pushed by grassroots movements urging Democrats to back Medicare for All, free public college tuition, a $15 minimum wage, and a bevy of other progressive goals.
(...)
Some prominent Democrats have in recent weeks indicated that they agree with this critique, and with the majority of their voters.
Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.) angered centrist Democrats back in August when she told the audience of a Netroots Nation conference in Atlanta, Georgia that "the Democratic Party isn't going back to the*days of welfare reform and the crime bill."

"We're not going back to the days when a Democrat who wanted to run for a seat in*Washington first had to grovel on Wall Street," Warren added.
Record support among congressional Democrats for Medicare for All and a $15 federal minimum wage also indicates that Democrats are beginning to shift left under pressure from the grassroots.

Consistent with previous surveys, the new Harvard-Harris poll also found that Sanders is far and away the most popular politician in the country, while President Donald Trump and the congressional leadership of both parties remain broadly unpopular.
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Neoliberals need to be careful what they wish for, they may receive it!
 
My apologies neoconservatives and Neoliberals are such birds of a feather that I frequently conflate them as one ideology divided by party of affiliation.
 
I would hate for the progressives to form their own party. Stick with the Democrats and I would strongly suggest requiring any Senate or House candidates looking for the party's backing to be required to sign a statement indicating that they will support impeachment of President Trump.
 
Brainster said:
I would hate for the progressives to form their own party. Stick with the Democrats and I would strongly suggest requiring any Senate or House candidates looking for the party's backing to be required to sign a statement indicating that they will support impeachment of President Trump.
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Progressives really see no benefit to impeaching Trump at the current time, it would create more problems than it would resolve. It is far better to stalemate him and tie him to the GOP as strongly as possible, he is their lodestone to bear. If he has created impeachable offenses and such can be clearly and compellingly supported by a preponderance of evidence, then of course he should be impeached, and if convicted he should be removed from office. Personally, I see no real benefit to removing President Trump to replace him with a president Pence, unless there is compelling evidence that president Trump has committed serious crimes in his term as president.
 
Of course the Right wants a new "progressive" party. The party that divides is the party that looses. GOP has stronger party unity, which was a major factor that made it easier for them to steal 2016.
 
ChristianProgressive said:
Of course the Right wants a new "progressive" party. The party that divides is the party that looses. GOP has stronger party unity, which was a major factor that made it easier for them to steal 2016.
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The only thing that made it easier for the Right to win in 2016, was the Left's rightwing neoliberal corruption and chicanery insuring that Hillary Clinton was the DNC nominee. Even then, 90+% of Sanders' supporters held their nose and voted for the Democratic candidate. If the DNC continues to keep trying the same BS that they've been pulling since 2015, in 2018, they will force progressives to seek alternative electoral satisfaction.

Now that more than half of the Democratic electorate is looking for bold progressive moves going forward, the only way that progressives will abandon the Democratic party is if the current DNC leadership continues to rig the process and deny their electorate the progress they expect.

Progressives aren't looking for a party of their own, but they aren't going to keep following the DNC as long as they continue to do the things they have the last few years. Now is the time for the Democratic party to show that they embrace progressives and Progressive public policy, or they can keep doing as they have been doing and proceed without Progressive support and participation.
 
I thought that Trakar broke with Bernie because he did not agree with Bernie's stand on Nuclear Power......

I think if there is any new party it will be centrists like me who think both parties have become too extreme.
 
Trump's "win" in the EC states was ~70-100,000 across 3-4 states. That missing 10% Bernie purists could have made a significant difference.
 
dudalb said:
I thought that Trakar broke with Bernie because he did not agree with Bernie's stand on Nuclear Power......

I think if there is any new party it will be centrists like me who think both parties have become too extreme.
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GOP-Lite Hillary was "too extreme"...taking a moment to process that...
 
I'm not liking conceding the future to the Right by continuing this unnecessary bickering on the left.
 
I do think it's going to be pretty much a knock-down, drag-out fight for the heart and soul of the Democrats next time around. The last election makes it harder for the DLC-types to argue that their way is the only one that results in an electable candidate.
 
PhantomWolf said:
Originally Posted by Trakar View Post
The only thing that made it easier for the Right to win in 2016, was the Left's rightwing neoliberal corruption and chicanery insuring that Hillary Clinton was the DNC nominee.
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:rolleyes:
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Was it the only thing? No. But it was certainly a big thing. NYC just admitted what Bernie supporters had been alleging since the primaries: they illegally purged large numbers of voters.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/pol...purged-200-000-voters-rolls-article-1.3586490
 
ChristianProgressive said:
Was it the only thing? No. But it was certainly a big thing. NYC just admitted what Bernie supporters had been alleging since the primaries: they illegally purged large numbers of voters.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/pol...purged-200-000-voters-rolls-article-1.3586490
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Yes, the NYC's Board of Elections did it, not the DNC, nor did they do it on behalf of the DNC nor Clinton. While Democrats seem to have been the worst affected, the areas were (such as parts of Brooklyn) often heavily Black in population, and Blacks tended to vote in greater numbers for Clinton than Sanders.

Do you have any actual proof of nefarious business by the DNC undercutting Sanders in favour of Clinton, or will you take Trakar's line that the DNC should have applied some nebulous support to Sanders and then fail to show what support he didn't get from them that he was entitled to, or that Clinton got given?
 
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Trakar said:
Be careful what you wish for!

As Tensions Simmer, Poll Shows Majority of Democrats Want Bold Leftward Shift

https://www.commondreams.org/news/2...s-majority-democrats-want-bold-leftward-shift

The survey suggests Democratic voters want to ditch the current party leadership and embrace the grassroots



Neoliberals need to be careful what they wish for, they may receive it!
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I get that history and foreign affairs aren't your strong suit but this has been tried before, with the only twist being the lefties kept the old party name and the centrists left. I give you Labour and the SDP. This brilliant move contributed to keep a right wing Thatcherite government in power for 17 years. Oh and it wasn't the radical left who came out on top in the end, it was those very neo-liberals you despise so much. But hey go right ahead and split the opposition, the Republicans will toast the names of those who lead the split for decades to come.
 
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