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Student Loan Forgiveness

In the UK student debt tapers off to forgiveness eventually if you don't earn above median income. That seems like the best kind of solution.
 
Perhaps governments should take a market driven approach to student loans.
 
I agree. Sounds like a good idea to me.
A common criticism of the US system is that the prospect of graduate debt is a severe disincentive to people going to college when they do not already come from a rich background (in which their family might take care of it).

What was your experience in this regard?
 
In the UK student debt tapers off to forgiveness eventually if you don't earn above median income. That seems like the best kind of solution.

This isn't the only route to forgiveness. Live abroad for (I think) 20 years, and your debt is written off. This is part of the reason one of my daughters lives abroad, and anecdotally, there is something above an insignificant number of here fellow students who have done the same thing for the same reason.
 
A common criticism of the US system is that the prospect of graduate debt is a severe disincentive to people going to college when they do not already come from a rich background (in which their family might take care of it).

What was your experience in this regard?

A bit lengthy, but here goes. (Sorry bout that.)

I think my experience, and thousands others like me, is different from most graduates in the US, in that I chose to attend a for-profit private college. I was young, stupid, and naive when I went to check out the school. I, like many others who attended the Art Institutes and Corinthian Colleges, were duped into accepting at face value the job placement ratings the recruiters presented. Essentially, I did not expect to be lied to to my face. I also accepted that they actively help students obtain a job in their field upon graduation. They have a job fair just before graduation, and their occupation placement department was supposed to keep in contact with you regarding job oppurtunities.

Little did I know, the job placement ratings were inflated (they were claiming kids who already had jobs before going to school, and holding onto the exact same job after graduation.) They did not actively help us find jobs. And the so-called "job fair" was a complete joke. Only 5 employers showed up, and three of those were just looking for some quick, temporary free-lance work to be done. And the people who were supposed to have contacts for you, and to keep in contact with you? Well, they never once returned a single phone call. The one time I did get a call from the school, was to remind me to repay my student loans!

I then later found out that my degree was all but worthless to the most serious of employers. Art Institute? It's a joke in the professional world of web development. Now, I am 80 grand in debt, have a decent job that has nothing to do with my field, and on the verge of having to declare bankruptcy. (Except, bankruptcy laws do not cover student loans!)

That's my experience.

Those who attend a public university, I think, have a fighting chance to get a job to help pay off their loans. Most state universities and their subsidiaries are not too bad. Mansfield University, about an hour drive north of where I live, for instance, "only" costs about $20,000 in total.

Then, too, it depends on the state. The state of California has a much better education system than any other state. College grads owe almost nothing upon graduation. Residents of the state can go to school practically for free. And their state universities are hailed as some of the best universities in the country. (Remember, the US is strange. We have 50 different school systems, where most countries only have 1. And the 50 different school systems can vary drastically.)

It was a follow-on to the joke that a couple of paintings would see off the debt.

lol. I see. :D
 
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This isn't the only route to forgiveness. Live abroad for (I think) 20 years, and your debt is written off. This is part of the reason one of my daughters lives abroad, and anecdotally, there is something above an insignificant number of here fellow students who have done the same thing for the same reason.

Unfortunately, us Americans are greedy sum bishes. An American creditor will hunt you down to the ends of the earth, if you owe him a single dime.
 
A bit lengthy, but here goes. (Sorry bout that.)

I think my experience, and thousands others like me, is different from most graduates in the US, in that I chose to attend a for-profit private college. I was young, stupid, and naive when I went to check out the school. I, like many others who attended the Art Institutes and Corinthian Colleges, were duped into accepting at face value the job placement ratings the recruiters presented. Essentially, I did not expect to be lied to to my face. I also accepted that they actively help students obtain a job in their field upon graduation. They have a job fair just before graduation, and their occupation placement department was supposed to keep in contact with you regarding job oppurtunities.

Little did I know, the job placement ratings were inflated (they were claiming kids who already had jobs before going to school, and holding onto the exact same job after graduation.) They did not actively help us find jobs. And the so-called "job fair" was a complete joke. Only 5 employers showed up, and three of those were just looking for some quick, temporary free-lance work to be done. And the people who were supposed to have contacts for you, and to keep in contact with you? Well, they never once returned a single phone call. The one time I did get a call from the school, was to remind me to repay my student loans!

I then later found out that my degree was all but worthless to the most serious of employers. Art Institute? It's a joke in the professional world of web development. Now, I am 80 grand in debt, have a decent job that has nothing to do with my field, and on the verge of having to declare bankruptcy. (Except, bankruptcy laws do not cover student loans!)

That's my experience.

Those who attend a public university, I think, have a fighting chance to get a job to help pay off their loans. Most state universities and their subsidiaries are not too bad. Mansfield University, about an hour drive north of where I live, for instance, "only" costs about $20,000 in total.

Then, too, it depends on the state. The state of California has a much better education system than any other state. College grads owe almost nothing upon graduation. Residents of the state can go to school practically for free. And their state universities are hailed as some of the best universities in the country. (Remember, the US is strange. We have 50 different school systems, where most countries only have 1. And the 50 different school systems can vary drastically.)



lol. I see. :D

Young relative of our did similar... We advised him to go to DAVE School in Orlando. He decided on another . Got taken for a ride, his animation work is barely acceptable - after two years of being told how well he was doing. Can't get work in his chosen field and owes over 80K $US.
 
In the UK student debt tapers off to forgiveness eventually if you don't earn above median income. That seems like the best kind of solution.

Yeah - that's a great solution if the goal is to prop up failing institutions that are not producing value.

We see this w/ the US bank or GM bailouts. First government money is used to cause market distortions- propping up losers and dis-advantaging the winners. Then to populist panderers start the drum-beat, "we're paying for them so let the government manage them too". The only thing missing in this scenario is sending those who disagree off to re-education camps or killing-fields.
 
This is why I am very concerned about the possibility of a Democratic vote split that allows a republicker slime to win again. Of course I will be very happy if a major split happens with the republicker mad rush to be ass wiper for the Kochs and related.
Exactly right. Thats the same reason why fox news.can get away with claiming they are "most popular news source." Virtually all other sources are "liberal" in comparison. Im hesitant voting green for that reason. At least the democratic party more or less picks up on the issues the greens espouse. Their just slower in doing so.
 
Yeah - that's a great solution if the goal is to prop up failing institutions that are not producing value.

We see this w/ the US bank or GM bailouts. First government money is used to cause market distortions- propping up losers and dis-advantaging the winners. Then to populist panderers start the drum-beat, "we're paying for them so let the government manage them too". The only thing missing in this scenario is sending those who disagree off to re-education camps or killing-fields.
Uuuuuummmmmmmm the "free market" has huge failures that are propped up through lies and distortions regarding their outcomes. Thats why we have such a huge problem with debt in this country!! Give me two examples of a failed university propped up by the goverenment, and what it costs.
 
I feel sorry for you. I really do. I've had applicants who can't afford to take jobs paying +/- $40,000/year because they have too much student loan debt. But that's the market rate for a starting salary for someone with their qualifications (soil science, agriculture, environmental science, but not engineers). I think that the government should get out of the student loan business completely, because as Stevea said, it distorted the market substantially.

Not sure about student loan forgiveness. If it is done at all, it should be equitable for all student loans, or there is even more market distortion. Not sure if this would mean paying a sum to those who have already paid off loans. Perhaps there could be a work program associated with this, like "Teach For America."

I'm a graduate of the Cal State system myself, from the 1980s. I still had to work 3 part time jobs and lived off campus. I never experienced what is considered the "college experience" of living in a dorm, studying instead of working, and going to college parties. I graduated with no student loan debt. I think the full college experience should be reserved for those who can pay for it out of their own funds at the time, and not have to pay for it for twenty more years after they graduate.
 
Yeah - that's a great solution if the goal is to prop up failing institutions that are not producing value.
That isn't the goal, it may be a side effect, but you can not have everything.

It is insurance for the student not the college. If alumni of Crapchester Uni don't get jobs but have their fees eventually waived that doesn't help Crapchester.

If students are exposed to the idiosyncratic yet diversifiable risk that they might not get high enough paying employment to finance their degree, then you have a mechanism that dis-incentivises folks from poor backgrounds with extreme precision. That is bad social policy. It is the worse of the two evils.
 
I think the full college experience should be reserved for those who can pay for it out of their own funds at the time, and not have to pay for it for twenty more years after they graduate.
A rich Mom+Dad's club then?

I thought the Frat/Soro system in the US was horrendous enough already.
 

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