You must love yourself first..??

[Atlas]

I got a book advert emailed to me. Promo ideas discussed

"You can't love someone until you learn to love yourself."

"Learning to love yourself": Despite Whitney Houston's self-help anthem, "Learning to Love Yourself Is the Greatest Love of All," loving us is someone else's job, and loving someone else is a prerequisite to the right to love ourselves. Putting ourselves first makes us contemptible, both to others and to ourselves.

The first time I heard the first quote I thought, "hogwash". That was decades ago - does it pass for common wisdom today?

I can argue with part of the second quote. Putting ourselves first does not automatically make us contemptible. Survival requires it. Still, survival requires cooperation, helping and nurturing others. We're social creatures, denying it is alienating and self destructive in my opinion.

How do you see it? Anyone seen Ayn Rand around?

 

[Darat]

I've heard it said quite a few times, most people just nod or agree, it's fun when you ask the person who uttered it "What on earth do you mean by that? "

(No party invites, again, this month - don’t know why.)

(E'ited.)

 

[Seismosaurus]

Rather depends on what you mean by "love". There are a lot of different shades of meaning to that word.

The best definition of love I ever heard was that you love somebody if you place more importance on their well being than you do on your own. (I don't claim this as the "real" definition, it's just one that I like.) By that definition it's nonsensical to love yourself.

Whatever the precise definition, love is always associated with a great degree of affection, even reverence. It's kinda iffy to direct that towards yourself, for obvious reasons.

But I think the intent of the line is is that it's difficult for other people to love you if you don't respect yourself - if you don't think you are worthy of love, then others don't either. From my own experience I'd say that that's at least possibly true, but it's a different thing than saying that you need to actually love yourself.

 

[Skeptic]

"You can't love someone until you learn to love yourself."

"He who falls in love with himself, won't encounter much competition"--Voltaire.

 

[Scot C. Trypal]

Not quite sure why, but it strikes me as odd and improbable to have really strong feeling like love or hate about your self. While I guess some people honestly do, it still sounds to me like a driver trying to see his own car in the rearview mirror.

Along the same lines, another one that gets to me a bit is the “You complete me” notion of love and family, as though the other person is there to be the missing cog in your clock, there to make you complete. Seems best to me if you both see yourselves as cogs completing something larger.

 

[Mycroft]

Where I come from self-love and self-abuse are euphamisms for the same thing.

 

[Cleon]

Well, some of us have enough skill/luck with the opposite sex that we don't need to, uh, "love ourselves."

 

[Lord Muck oGentry]

The first time I heard the first quote I thought, "hogwash". That was decades ago - does it pass for common wisdom today?

It probably does, at least among those for whom low self-esteem is always a shocking injustice, never the judgement of a shrewd critic.

 

[Atlas]

So where are all the Whitney Houston fans?

ETA: OK, that's tasteless.

 

[epepke]

I've heard it said quite a few times, most people just nod or agree, it's fun when you ask the person who uttered it "What on earth do you mean by that? "

I'll answer as a public service.

When people dislike themselves, they often take it out on other people, especially those who try to get close to them. This causes bad things to happen and pretty reliably ruins any close relationships in time. Any attempt to solve this problem requires as a precondition or early cocondition acquiring the ability to love oneself.

One could, of course, argue whether "you can't love someone until you learn to love yourself." is the best possible way of saying that, but that would be like responding to "a stitch in time saves nine" with "How do you know it's exactly nine? It could be eight, or ten, or even five. And haven't you ever heard of hot glue?" Aphorisms are aphorisms.

 

[The Central Scrutinizer]

So where are all the Whitney Houston fans?

ETA: OK, that's tasteless.

 

[Darat]

In party-mode .

I'll answer as a public service.

When people dislike themselves,

What do you mean by "dislike themselves"?

they often take it out on other people,

What evidence supports this?

especially those who try to get close to them.

What do you mean by "get close", and the follow-up what evidence is there of this?

This causes bad things to happen and pretty reliably ruins any close relationships in time.

What evidence means that it can be concluded this "dislike of themselves" is the cause of the relationship problems?

Any attempt to solve this problem requires as a precondition or early cocondition acquiring the ability to love oneself.

...snip...

This is circular - it is assuming the conclusion to support the original phrase.

 

[Skeptic]

When people dislike themselves, they often take it out on other people, especially those who try to get close to them. This causes bad things to happen and pretty reliably ruins any close relationships in time.

It depends what you mean by "bad things". If you mean things like clamming up, being depressed and withdrawn, occassional shouting for no reason, nervousness, etc., then, sure, low self-esteem can lead to that.

But if by "bad things" you mean beating their spouse up and abandoning their children, that is almost done by people who see themselves as kings of the world and everybody else as servants regardless of their behavior--the exact opposite of "low self-esteem".

I, for one, think that things would have been better if more people would have lower self-esteem, instead of being told how wonderful they are and how they must love themselves.