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xkcd remains awesome

Quinn

Breathtakingly blasphemous.
Quinn
Joined
Jan 6, 2002
Messages
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A new strip worthy of its own appreciation thread (so say I):

dilution.png


Rollover text: "Dear editors of Homeopathy Monthly: I have two small corrections for your July issue. One, it's spelled 'echinacea', and two, homeopathic medicines are no better than placebos and your entire magazine is a sham."
 
Quinn said:
A new strip worthy of its own appreciation thread (so say I):
Click to expand...

It already has it's own appreciation thread on the XKCD forum here.

But because you started one here, I'll write what I didn't write there, because I can't be bothered to sign up to that forum...

Technically, wouldn't diluted sperm be a homeopathic contraceptive?
 
TubbaBlubba said:
... Oh. I was thinking "30 times".
Click to expand...


In homoeopathic terms "x" (or sometimes "D") means a 1 in 10 dilution. The number is the number of times it has been repeated. 30C is a much more commonly used dilution - a 1 in 100 dilution repeated 30 times, or 1 in 1060.
 
Brian-M said:
Technically, wouldn't diluted sperm be a homeopathic contraceptive?
Click to expand...


No, that would be "isopathy". A homoeopathic contraceptive would be something that produces symptoms similar to those experienced by pregnant women.
 
They would first have to do some "proving".

At first Hahnemann used material doses for provings, but he later advocated proving with remedies at a 30C dilution.


eeeeaawwww......
 
Indeed. "Like cures like" doesn't actually forbid using the exact same substance that caused the disease in the first place. You're perfectly allowed to cure a caffeine-induced insomnia with a 30x dilution of caffeine.

Of course, my better example there is: given that a lot of the water you get back is essentially recycled, that water is supposed to have memory, and even turn any other water it comes into contact with into even more potent cure... well, a lot of people jack off in the shower. Wouldn't tap water be an very strong contraceptive?
 
HansMustermann said:
Of course, my better example there is: given that a lot of the water you get back is essentially recycled, that water is supposed to have memory, and even turn any other water it comes into contact with into even more potent cure... well, a lot of people jack off in the shower. Wouldn't tap water be an very strong contraceptive?
Click to expand...
*sigh* a common strawman, I'm afraid.

For a start, homeopaths don't usually use water in their dilutions. It's usually lactose or something. I don't know exactly what.

Secondly, and more importantly, water does not acquire a memory unless it is succussed. This is an essential process, without which homeopathic dilutions are not considered effective. So Tim Minchin's line about "it somehow manages to forget all the poo it's had in it" does not apply to "real" homeopathy.

There's plenty to criticise in homeopathy without resorting to straw men. The "homeopathic overdose" is another example of a strawman argument. Let's just stick with placebo-controlled double-blind tests and not resort to arguments that homeopaths can easily dismiss, hmm?
 
HansMustermann said:
Of course, my better example there is: given that a lot of the water you get back is essentially recycled, that water is supposed to have memory, and even turn any other water it comes into contact with into even more potent cure... well, a lot of people jack off in the shower. Wouldn't tap water be an very strong contraceptive?
Click to expand...

I don't want to know how you determined "a lot of people ..." Your shower drains into a sewer where it mixes with other waste water from kitchen sinks and toilets. It evenutally reaches a waste water treatment plant where the water's memory is erased by proximity to quantum crystal vibrations and monopolar magnets.
 
arthwollipot said:
*sigh* a common strawman, I'm afraid.

For a start, homeopaths don't usually use water in their dilutions. It's usually lactose or something. I don't know exactly what.
Click to expand...

It's usually a mixture of alcohol and water which is then dripped on to a sugar (lactose) pill, which somehow magically copies the knowledge of the water and preserves it.

Some homeopaths have discovered that you don't actually need to drip on every pill though. It turns out it works just as well if you just anoint one pill then put it in a bottle with a hundred others and shake it up a bit. That sugar pill tells all of the other sugar pills what to do and they turn into remedies too. Homeopathy really is amazing.

Secondly, and more importantly, water does not acquire a memory unless it is succussed. This is an essential process, without which homeopathic dilutions are not considered effective. So Tim Minchin's line about "it somehow manages to forget all the poo it's had in it" does not apply to "real" homeopathy.

There's plenty to criticise in homeopathy without resorting to straw men. The "homeopathic overdose" is another example of a strawman argument. Let's just stick with placebo-controlled double-blind tests and not resort to arguments that homeopaths can easily dismiss, hmm?
Click to expand...

I think Rolfe said it first, but sometimes it's an advantageous debating strategy to make a simple point against homeopathy, and make the homeopath give the complicated explanation that sends the audience to sleep. Normally the homeopath gets to tell nice, simple, appealing lies and then the skeptic has to talk for ten minutes to explain the science that debunks them.

Chugging a bottle of pills and saying "Look, there's nothing in these bloody things!" is a lot more effective for many audiences than a lecture on blinding, placebos, experimenter bias, regression to the mean and self-limiting conditions.

That said, a forum like this is not really a venue where we need such tactics.
 
Kevin_Lowe said:
Some homeopaths have discovered that you don't actually need to drip on every pill though. It turns out it works just as well if you just anoint one pill then put it in a bottle with a hundred others and shake it up a bit. That sugar pill tells all of the other sugar pills what to do and they turn into remedies too.
Click to expand...


They call it "grafting". And, indeed, the grafted pills work just as well as regular homoeopathic pills.
 
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