Originally Posted by Huntster
I hate the political and judicial power California wields over Alaska, don't give much of a damn about Maslow's Heirarchy, and would absolutely love the prospect of California becoming it's own nation.
Really? You wouldn't mind one of the major centers of science, education, agriculture, and natural beauty becoming a foreign power? You really should be careful what you wish for.
That major center of science, education, agriculture, and natural beauty can't seem to provide enough energy to meet their needs. They need to trade like everybody else.
What I can do without from California is their cultural, political, idealogical, and judicial meddling. Political seperation might help that. Ultimately, though, it would be a small change. Just like the past 40 years, cultural refugees from California infect other areas (started with Oregon in the 1960s, then the Rockies, now Alaska, etc). People screwed California up with their wacky ideas, got sick of it, moved to other places, then proceeded to do the same thing all over again.
Idiots.
Originally Posted by Huntster
It wouldn't be the first time, and like the last time, it wouldn't last long......
And it took the deadliest war this country has ever seen to bring it back together. Would you call that a good thing?
You talking about the War Between the States?
No, it wasn't a good thing.
Originally Posted by Huntster
Like bullets. You'd be surprised what they can do.
No, I know what they can do. Sometimes, but not always, they bring about political change. Is it worth the price? Sometimes. I still favor diplomacy.
Me, too. As long as it works.
Originally Posted by Huntster
Let the bullets and bombs run their course. Then let's talk oil/money.
Bullets and bombs have been "running their course" ever since they were invented. Do you expect that to end any time soon?
Nope. That will never end.
Do you think talking oil/money needs to wait until there are no bullets flying?
Nope. I think talking oil/money can go forward while the terrorists are rooted out and killed with extreme prejudice, but at no time can terrorists participate in oil/money talks, and at no time should rooting them out to be eliminated be ended.
Originally Posted by Huntster
You were right.
I was in the same camp.
I'm glad to hear that, although I suspect our reasons were different.
I'd say we both simply recognized reality.
Originally Posted by Huntster
It's easy to win a war.
Not true. It's easy if you have overwhelming power. Even then it is iffy. Has Israel won their war over the people who hate them? They have lots of power.
Each time their Arab neighbors attacked Israel, Israel emerged victorious.
It was more a matter of will, determination, and tactics than raw power.
They have still not "won the peace", because that's impossible.
Get it yet?
Originally Posted by Huntster
It's impossible to win peace.
Also not always true. US relations with Vietnam are fairly good now. And Japan, the country we dropped the A-bombs on, is one of our greatest allies. Germany too.
You (or any individual or entity) have no control over a mutual endeavor. I cannot force or compel someone to be peaceful. Peace is a two way street. Those who you wish peace with must want it, too.
Originally Posted by Huntster
Don't need to be much of a prophet to know that.
Well, I wish Bushco had had such a prophet. They couldn't seem to figure it out, nor did they have any realistic plans for what to do after the war.
It's not their problem. It's the Iraqi's problem. The goal was to eliminate Saddam, and for obvious reasons. If the Iraqis can't get it together, there's nothing
anybody else can do about it.
