What is this?

[GlennB]

http://mceer.buffalo.edu/publications/wtc/02-SP02Screen.pdf

page 11

the upper part of the photo that is, that looks like an old lath+plaster arrangement

clues gratefully received - I'm guessing a section of office floor but I haven't seen a debris photo like this before

eta: bottom right is a section of outer wall with a plume of fine dust trailing behind it. Would this be powder from drywalling?

regards

(cheers Huntsman)

 

[Hellbound]

Glenn:

Might want to give a page number. Your link opens the PDF title page.

 

[Oliver]

http://mceer.buffalo.edu/publications/wtc/02-SP02Screen.pdf

the upper part of the photo that is, that looks like an old lath+plaster arrangement

clues gratefully received - I'm guessing a section of office floor but I haven't seen a debris photo like this before

regards

Thanks a lot, Glenn - i nerver seen this before - still studying... I´m sure Chris is running wild now, i guess... - all this concrete...

 

[Gravy]

That's a 5-6 story section of the outer wall of the south tower. The gray covering is the aluminum sheathing, and the reddish material beneath is the steel.

ETA: I didn't see your eta, Glenn!

 

[Hellbound]

Thanks for updating GlennB

Gravy is correct, near as I can tell. That's pieces of the outer shell.

 

[CurtC]

I've read that the outer perimeter columns were 14 inches across, spaced wide enough that the windows in-between then were about 36 inches wide. Is this correct?

The chunk of structure falling in that photo seems to be more column area than window area.

 

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

I've read that the outer perimeter columns were 14 inches across, spaced wide enough that the windows in-between then were about 36 inches wide. Is this correct?

The chunk of structure falling in that photo seems to be more column area than window area.

Wow, something useful did come out of the Christophera thread. I still had these saved:

In short, yes.

 

[GlennB]

I've read that the outer perimeter columns were 14 inches across, spaced wide enough that the windows in-between then were about 36 inches wide. Is this correct?

The chunk of structure falling in that photo seems to be more column area than window area.

Exactly. The falling sections at bottom right in the photo match Arkan's diagrams and photos of the wall.

The large section at top centre is mostly 'column' with no windows. At the 3 o'clock edge of this there is an unbroken plain gray area, which is what suggested to me that this might be a concrete floor section seen from underneath.

 

[CurtC]

Well, in Arkan's photo, it looks as if the aluminum shell around each column is quite a bit bigger than the actual 14 inch column itself, so that makes the columns appear wider and the windows narrower. But still, that photo of the falling section looks to be 3/4 columns and 1/4 windows.

 

[celestrin]

Here's a clearer view of a portion of the picture.

pbase.com/peteburke73/image/2281432/original

Caution. Picture may contain graphic content, I believe there's someone falling at bottom right.

As far as the "top center, mostly column thingy" goes - remember that we're seeing most of the columns still with aluminum cladding attached. That would tighten the space available for windows. Arkan's diagram doesn't show the aluminum.

But, above all - we're seeing the columns from the side, which exposes them diagonally, once again forshortening the space available for windows. It's the perspective thing, just like Arkan's top picture. We can easily see the windows up the middle of the building, but once we look to the sides, windows practically disappear.

 

[Oliver]

Here's a clearer view of a portion of the picture.

pbase.com/peteburke73/image/2281432/original

Caution. Picture may contain graphic content, I believe there's someone falling at bottom right.

As far as the "top center, mostly column thingy" goes - remember that we're seeing most of the columns still with aluminum cladding attached. That would tighten the space available for windows. Arkan's diagram doesn't show the aluminum.

But, above all - we're seeing the columns from the side, which exposes them diagonally, once again forshortening the space available for windows. It's the perspective thing, just like Arkan's top picture. We can easily see the windows up the middle of the building, but once we look to the sides, windows practically disappear.

Thank you for the link to the picture and the gallery.

http://pbase.com/peteburke73/image/2281432/original
http://pbase.com/peteburke73/september_11&page=2

And a hearty welcome to the board,
Oliver

 

[GlennB]

Here's a clearer view of a portion of the picture.

pbase.com/peteburke73/image/2281432/original

Caution. Picture may contain graphic content, I believe there's someone falling at bottom right.

As far as the "top center, mostly column thingy" goes - remember that we're seeing most of the columns still with aluminum cladding attached. That would tighten the space available for windows. Arkan's diagram doesn't show the aluminum.

But, above all - we're seeing the columns from the side, which exposes them diagonally, once again forshortening the space available for windows. It's the perspective thing, just like Arkan's top picture. We can easily see the windows up the middle of the building, but once we look to the sides, windows practically disappear.

Many thanks celestrin. Makes sense now.
What looked like an expanse of plain material in the right edge of that piece is in fact a gap framing the dust behind it.

And yes, that is a very harrowing photo.

 

[Gravy]

But, above all - we're seeing the columns from the side, which exposes them diagonally, once again forshortening the space available for windows. It's the perspective thing, just like Arkan's top picture. We can easily see the windows up the middle of the building, but once we look to the sides, windows practically disappear.

That's correct. As this diagram shows, the windows were recessed. The design wasn't made for optimum viewing from inside. The story is that the architect, Minoru Yamasaki, was afraid of heights, and he designed the windows to be narrower than his shoulders, so that when he was standing close to them he didn't have the feeling that he would fall out. That's the story, anyway.

eta: As I'm thinking about it, since wind load was such a factor in the design of the building, I wonder why they chose a design that presented so much column surface area to the wind. It makes a positive difference aesthetically, when viewing the building from outside, but I wonder how much differently a "smoother" building would behave in the wind.

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