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What does this sign mean?

CFLarsen

Penultimate Amazing
C
Joined
Aug 3, 2001
Messages
42,371
Does this mean "peace"?

tnd.gif
 
Edited to delete informative, and unasked for post. I overlooked the polling nature of the question.

No Bye the bye.
 
Now you are dis-covering that history is in a state of constant change. It is purely a figment of imagination.

Peace.
 
When I first heard about the meaning the sign had according to the designer, I was quite surprised. In this corner of the world the sign is known as the 'Ban The Bomb' sign, and I had always assumed it simply depicted a stylised archetype of a military missile, with those stabilisation wings, in a circle like a traffic sign showing what is prohibited. Like this:

banbomb.gif


I never imaged that it had anything to do with the letters N and D, and I can't see those in the symbol anyway.
 
Earthborn said:
I never imaged that it had anything to do with the letters N and D, and I can't see those in the symbol anyway.
Click to expand...
"N" is the two flags pointing at an angle toward the ground and "D" is one straight up, the other straight down.
Superimpose the two, you get ND.
 
I don't get it. Your description doesn't help much, Jeff. "One straight up, one straight down", doesn't that make a straight line instead of a D?

Is this the N?

n.gif


and is this the D?

d.gif


Or this?

sd.gif


And what is wrong with a nice W?

w.gif


Or P?

p.gif


How about a Q?

q.gif


I find it easier to see a picture in it. I can see the hemispheres of the brain in it, with the cerebellum below them. Perhaps people using their brain are assumed to be against nuclear weapons?

Or perhaps the head of an insect, with large facet eyes and its jaws, showing the only thing that can survive a nuclear conflict? I dunno...
 
some fundies think it is the invertied Xian cross and broken.

that means it is the sign on the devil etc.



Virgil
 
Earthborn said:
Aha! (Erlebnis...)

Thanks.
Click to expand...
Sorry, should have been more specific. People don't use the semaphores much anymore. Nor Morse code.
... .... .. _ !
 
It may not have originated as a generic sign for peace, but that is what it has come to mean.

In the Illuminatus trilogy, you find out that it is an ancient Atlantean torture device that the Illuminati made into a peace symbol out of a sense of irony.
 
flyboy217 said:
Trick question?
Click to expand...

Trick question. :)


Lucianarchy said:
Now you are dis-covering that history is in a state of constant change. It is purely a figment of imagination.

Peace.
Click to expand...

As usual, you get it wrong. We are not talking about history (which is not a figment of imagination, but a careful study of accumulated evidence of past events), but the interpretation of a symbol.

Earthborn said:
When I first heard about the meaning the sign had according to the designer, I was quite surprised. In this corner of the world the sign is known as the 'Ban The Bomb' sign, and I had always assumed it simply depicted a stylised archetype of a military missile, with those stabilisation wings, in a circle like a traffic sign showing what is prohibited.
Click to expand...

That's a new one! But I can see how you got it.

Jeff Corey said:
"N" is the two flags pointing at an angle toward the ground and "D" is one straight up, the other straight down.
Superimpose the two, you get ND.
Click to expand...

And then, the circle, meaning "Total". Total Nuclear Disarmament. Not Peace.

flyboy217 said:
Seems most ppl think it means peace.
Click to expand...
Nyarlathotep said:
It may not have originated as a generic sign for peace, but that is what it has come to mean.
Click to expand...

And this is my point: Can we, over time, accept a change in the meaning of symbols, and if so, when should we do it?

In this case, the change seems not to have been deliberate, but is it possible to use, say, the Swastika in some other form, changing the meaning it has today? The Swastika was merely an old sun sign, before Hitler chose it as a symbol for his movement.
 
After some deliberation, I voted yes. I'm old enough to know the original meaning, but any symbol has the meaning people attach to it. Here is one example where appeal to polularity is actually valid.

The swastica is a good example. An age-old symbol that has probably been tainted forever.

Hans
 
CFLarsen said:

The Swastika was merely an old sun sign, before Hitler chose it as a symbol for his movement.
Click to expand...
But the Nazi swastika was mirror-inverted, so the old hindu sign can - and is, AFAIK - still be used.
 
steenkh said:
But the Nazi swastika was mirror-inverted, so the old hindu sign can - and is, AFAIK - still be used.
Click to expand...

Go check again. The symbol was used turning either way.

http://www.pinetreeweb.com/bp-can3.htm

MRC_Hans said:
After some deliberation, I voted yes. I'm old enough to know the original meaning, but any symbol has the meaning people attach to it. Here is one example where appeal to polularity is actually valid.
Click to expand...

Why?

steenkh said:
The swastica is a good example. An age-old symbol that has probably been tainted forever.
Click to expand...

Perhaps. It will sure take longer than your generation and mine to become dust before we (well, not "us", because we'll be dust...duh!) can see beyond the use of the Nazis.
 
Why?
Click to expand...
Well, I think that is obvious. A symbol is a means of mass communication (unless it's a secret symbol, of course ;)), and it communicates whatever the masses understand it to mean. If the majority of the population understands the old ND symbol as meaning "peace", then that is the meaning it will convey.

A thought experiment: Put a row of swasticas on the rear of your car, and see if you can convince anybody that "But it's an old sun symbol!"

.... BTW, put them on your left car door, right under the window, and it will convey an entirely different meaning ;). Symbol communication is an interesting thing.

Hans
 
I and, I think, most British people know the symbol as the logo of the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament (CND). I never heard of it being used as a general 'peace' symbol before today.
 
ceptimus said:
I and, I think, most British people know the symbol as the logo of the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament (CND). I never heard of it being used as a general 'peace' symbol before today.
Click to expand...

I'm going to have to go with ceptimus here.

Certainly with my background of political activism I can’t see it being anything but the symbol for the CND.

These threads can be so interesting - I'd never realised that it had come to be a generic "peace" symbol. When I've seen it carried in peace protests from other countries I'd just believed it was part of the CND and allied organisations general policy of protesting.

You live and learn

As an anecdote I remember in the 1980 s campaigning against the USA air forces in this country that had USA cruise missiles. On one particular "bases tour" (tour being the politically correct non-militaristic version of a "march" - peace organisations don't do marching!) I was nearly evicted from the march when I admitted that I was 100% against USA nuclear weapons on British soil but totally for British nuclear deterrents.

It was a dilemma for the organisers, the "tour" was about the campaign to get rid of the USA cruise missiles, which I was vehemently opposed to, yet the CND and the vast majority of people on the tour were against all nuclear weapons. I stayed and fought for my distinctly minority viewpoint.

I've never quite fitted in anywhere. ;)
 
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