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Vegetarian: Arguments For and Against Vegetarianism

beeksc1

A holographic observer
beeksc1
Joined
Jan 19, 2008
Messages
317
Vegetarianism is the practice of following a diet based on plant-based foods including fruits, vegetables, cereal grains, nuts, and seeds, with or without dairy products and eggs. A vegetarian does not eat meat, game, poultry, fish, crustacea, shellfish, or products of animal slaughter such as animal-derived gelatin and rennet.

In this forum, I viewed the poll "Are you vegetarian?" and the results indicated that about 11% of the voters on this forum do not consume meat as a part of their diet; but, it is likely that that figure will only rise in the future.

Obvious cases supporting a vegetarian diet include:
1. Health, nutrition
2. Ethics
3. Self-reliance

Cases supporting a carnivorous diet:
1. Freedom

Is it ethical, morally-sound for an individual to eat meat on a regular basis?
Should a person eat meat or not?
 
Okay, I thought it was self explanatory to include a theory of justification as to why it is all right to consume meat, if a person takes that stance.

So, is vegetarianism an ethical decision or is it merely a nutritional option?
 
Is it ethical to slaughter innocent plants to satisfy our animal urges for nutrition? Why place the burden solely on the plant kingdom when we are members of the animal kingdom? Are we really only able to empathise with things we can humanise?

Won't someone think of the asparagus?
 
beeksc1 said:
Is it ethical, morally-sound for an individual to eat meat on a regular basis?
Should a person eat meat or not?
Click to expand...

It is for me as my morals are about looking out for number one. If animals have to die so that I can get enjoyment out of it that's fine with me.

Yes as long as it isn't my flesh or that of anything that would upset me if it was killed.
 
Oh dear. Every discussion on vegetarianism at some point elicits the "but tomatoes have feelings too" school of comment.

I'm glad it's out the way now.
 
I know that this will be contentious, and it is not intended as a slight towards all vegetarians, many, many, many of whom have made a great contribution to humanity.

Unfortunately, I've met a lot of vegetarians who struggled to think through very basic bits of reasoning. This has made me wonder if it's possible to have dietary deficiencies that make thinking too hard.

My own experience of not eating meat was that I got it horribly wrong. I ended up with B12, Iron, Potassium and Cholesterol deficiencies. I had symptoms like multiple sclerosis.

This was despite having a good set of vegetarian diet guides and cook books.

These days, I just eat a little animal product every day...

I have heard persistent myths that increased red meat in diets seems to go hand in hand with increased aggression.
 
novaphile said:
I wish I could remember who said this first, but the first time I heard it, I thought it was hilarious!

Salad? Isn't that what food eats?

:)
Click to expand...

Ha, yes! That's what my fishin', huntin', redneck friend says about eating vegetables with his steak and taters.
 
beeksc1 said:
Cases supporting a carnivorous diet:
1. Freedom
Click to expand...
2. Humans evolved as omnivores so it's the diet our bodies are most adapted to.
3. Animal fat carries flavour and makes things taste good.

Note: I have nothing against vegetatianism. The protein and fat that an omnivorous diet gives you can quite easily still be supplied on a vegetarian diet as well, and it's certainly not the case that nothing tastes good unless it has fat. But your argument was extremely one-sided and ignored these two basic points, and probably others that I haven't thought of yet.
 
For me, it's just a personal food preference.

Most of the health-related reasons to not eat meat turned out to be bunk. (And, this is coming from someone who once tried to make health-related justifications in the past). A well-balanced diet can include some meat, though there are very good alternatives, in this day and age, for those who prefer not to consume such stuff.
(Obviously, there are going to be exceptions with folks who have very specific medical conditions in which eating meat is not a good idea.)

I find it hard to justify vegetarianism on any significant moral grounds, as well. Meat-eating is part of the heritage of human dietary evolution. As it is for much of the animal world, at large. And, killing an animal for food, in order to survive in a realm where one would otherwise perish, is hardly immoral.

I happen to like animals too much, to consciously chew them up and swallow them. But, that's just me. I would not force such an attitude onto anyone else.
 
beeksc1 said:
Obvious cases supporting a vegetarian diet include:
1. Health, nutrition
2. Ethics
3. Self-reliance
Click to expand...
4. Environmental protection.
5. Cost. In some places it is cheaper to get your nutritional requirements from a vegetarian diet.

Cases supporting a carnivorous diet:
1. Freedom
Click to expand...
2. Taste.
3. Easier to eat a healthy diet.
4. Cost. In some places it is cheaper to get your nutritional requirements from an omnivorous diet.
 
beeksc1 said:
Vegetarianism is the practice of following a diet based on plant-based foods including fruits, vegetables, cereal grains, nuts, and seeds, with or without dairy products and eggs. A vegetarian does not eat meat, game, poultry, fish, crustacea, shellfish, or products of animal slaughter such as animal-derived gelatin and rennet.

In this forum, I viewed the poll "Are you vegetarian?" and the results indicated that about 11% of the voters on this forum do not consume meat as a part of their diet; but, it is likely that that figure will only rise in the future.

Obvious cases supporting a vegetarian diet include:
1. Health, nutrition
2. Ethics
3. Self-reliance

Cases supporting a carnivorous diet:
1. Freedom

Is it ethical, morally-sound for an individual to eat meat on a regular basis?
Should a person eat meat or not?
Click to expand...

That's the carnivorous supporting argument?

How about:

1. Humans are omnivores (our teeth and digestive system are designed to handle a variety of matter - see link 1 for b.s. 101)
2. High in Protein
3. Fat, carbohydrates, cholersterol (in moderation, this is actually what humans need)
3. Health, nutrition, self-reliance (we are friggin' hunters by 'nature' or did the 50,000 prior years not count?)
4. We're not ruminant (a main feature of many large herbivorous animals). Evidence for humans with multiple stomachs, regurgitation (cud chewing), or gastropods, please.

There was a time that I considered vegetarianism but my friends talked me out of it because it limits some required inputs not found in other places. I still love fish (sushi, esp.) above most meats and eat tofu on occasion but don't pass on steak, chicken, pork, eggs either. Balance is it. We are not herbivores. We are not carnivores (even they eat plants once in a while). We are omnivores.

Links:

Bull about humans as pure celestial vegans

Another rant about the uselessness of meat

WikiMeat
 
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If we give cows the upper hand we're all DOOMED! :eek:
 
novaphile said:
Unfortunately, I've met a lot of vegetarians who struggled to think through very basic bits of reasoning. This has made me wonder if it's possible to have dietary deficiencies that make thinking too hard.
Click to expand...
This sounds anecdotal, and I'm also wondering if it's prone to selection bias.
My own experience of not eating meat was that I got it horribly wrong. I ended up with B12, Iron, Potassium and Cholesterol deficiencies. I had symptoms like multiple sclerosis.

This was despite having a good set of vegetarian diet guides and cook books.
Click to expand...
Might I ask why you were not eating meat, and what your diet consisted of? I'm not familiar with "vegetarian diet guides", but the particular nutrients you mention don't sound like they're too hard to get from a vegetarian diet per se. Were you shooting for a vegan diet?
These days, I just eat a little animal product every day...
Click to expand...
By animal product here, do you mean meat?
 
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