U.S. Marines go hungry

[FireGarden]

Is this for real?

http://www.timesrecordnews.com/trn/home/article/0,1891,TRN_5670_4667226,00.html

It's partially in response to the unthinkable image of U.S. Marines approaching Iraqi citizens and asking for food because they do not have enough.

I can't find a reference on more familiar news-sites.

 

[IIRichard]

It's certainly possible but unlikely. During the invasion phase, the Marines were moving so fast and so far that 2 meals, MRE's, a day wasn't unusual. At this point, thye base camps have PX's, high speed internet and so on.

I'll query my son (2/8 Marines) as to what's the likely explanation.

IIRichard

 

[Ziggurat]

Is this for real?

"Real" how so? Real as in they didn't outright lie? Maybe. Real as in gives an accurate representation of what's going on? I really doubt it.

Read the article carefully, and notice how they don't actually say that the Marines don't have enough food. They say stuff like the food wasn't "cutting it". The implication given is that there isn't enough, but that could just as easily be that the Marines don't like it much, and get sick of eating it for prolonged periods. So maybe they like to go to the locals, who by and large probably have tasty food (the closest I've been to Iraq is central Turkey, and the food there really is very good).

So how much of a problem is this? I don't know, but I doubt it's a big one. Hell, it might not be a problem at all. If, for example, troops are paying the locals for food, then they're injecting money into the local economy in one of the most productive and efficient ways they could. Maybe the Iraqis even like this because it's a way to earn good money. You really can't tell from the story, because there's so little actual information given. So this looks to me like it's a desperate attempt to turn what's probably a non-story (that Marines don't like military-supplied rations, and prefer either food from home or local cuisine) into yet another example of how terrible everything is going over there.

 

[FireGarden]

Read the article carefully, and notice how they don't actually say that the Marines don't have enough food. They say stuff like the food wasn't "cutting it". The implication given is that there isn't enough, but that could just as easily be that the Marines don't like it much, and get sick of eating it for prolonged periods.

It also says 2 meals a day. And that the marines lost 10 pounds in a few weeks.

Not malnutrition,
But you get the impression they're at least a little bit peckish!

But like you say, maybe it's true but over-egged!

I want a better journalist.

Or first hand comment......



IIRichard

I'll query my son (2/8 Marines) as to what's the likely explanation.

Is he in Iraq?

If he were hungry, wouldn't he have told you by now?

 

[tkingdoll]

Ziggurat's explanation sounds very likely. It's perfectly possible that the reporting media simply spun an anecdote about soldiers being given local food into this suspiciously propoganda-looking story.

 

[Cylinder]

Read the article carefully, and notice how they don't actually say that the Marines don't have enough food. They say stuff like the food wasn't "cutting it".

Actually, they make some straight-forward claims:

It's partially in response to the unthinkable image of U.S. Marines approaching Iraqi citizens and asking for food because they do not have enough.

So Nick Andoscia went to Iraq. And hunger soon followed.

The last thing he should have to worry about is an empty stomach. The last thing he should have to do is approach Iraqis and ask for food.

Subsidizing chow with local food sources has been going on since armies have packed their own lunch. MREs and T-rats get very old - very quickly.

There's also the question about the locals customs pamphlet issued to the soldiers and marines which very well may encourage this behavior.

The real question is if their TO&E is being met or not.

 

[Ziggurat]

It also says 2 meals a day. And that the marines lost 10 pounds in a few weeks.

Suppose there is enough food. Why might they only be having two meals a day? One possible answer is that they're damned busy, and don't have time to take more than two extended breaks a day. You don't exactly bring out the picnic table when you're on patrol in hostile territory. Why might they lose weight? Because they're working hard, under a lot of stress, and the food they have regular access to doesn't taste very good - that's a recipe for weight loss. Why might they want food from home if they have plenty of food from the military? Because the military food is bland, doesn't taste very good, and has little variety, and they want food that tastes closer to what they eat when not deployed. Do any of these things require a shortage of food? No, they do not. Everything in the article can be explained just as easily under a scenario of plenty of food as it can be under a food shortage scenario. Therefore we cannot conclude, based on anything in the article, that there is any shortage of food.

Smells to me like an imaginary crisis.

 

[jj]

I'm glad you guys can all dismiss this with a wave of the hand.

If we aren't feeding the troops out there in the war, I, for one, am even more peeved than I already was.

But I would like to hear from someone out there in the field.

Pirate Lad, are you out there? Anyone else?

 

[Rob Lister]

I'm glad you guys can all dismiss this with a wave of the hand.

I am. I don't buy it. Not even a little bit. It is an extraordinary claim and requires extraordinary evidence. I suspect each soldier is offered breakfast, lunch, dinner and even mid-rats (if leftovers exist). There may be many cases of soldiers being too busy to eat but, like another poster said, the food gets old real fast. Military chow is good the first time you eat it. By the 1000th time you've had "Yankee Pot Roast" you've likely about had your fill.

 

[Ziggurat]

Actually, they make some straight-forward claims:

No, actually, they don't make ANY straightforward claims about food shortages. Which is why I think it's a manufactured crisis: if there was a food shortage, they could just say so, but they never do. Instead, they just keep suggesting it. Let's look at your quotes, and see what I mean:

It's partially in response to the unthinkable image of U.S. Marines approaching Iraqi citizens and asking for food because they do not have enough.

Is that a straight-forward claim? No, it isn't straightforward at all. There's an "image" of marines not having enough food, but is the image real? The article never actually makes that claim. Is the food drive in response to marines ACTUALLY not having enough food? No, it isn't. Nothing straight-forward about this.

So Nick Andoscia went to Iraq. And hunger soon followed.

But why was he hungry? Again, this statement isn't nearly as straight-forward as you seem to think, and the article never says he was hungry because there wasn't enough food. Maybe he didn't have time for 3 meals a day, and finds himself hungry during the long stretch between the 2 he does have time for. Maybe the food is bland, and he finds himself hungering for food that tastes good. Shortage of food? No, we can't conclude that at all.

The last thing he should have to worry about is an empty stomach. The last thing he should have to do is approach Iraqis and ask for food.

But DOES he have to worry about that? Again, we aren't told. So yes, it's true, he shouldn't have to worry about this, but we don't know that he, or any other marines, actually do. We don't know how often marines DO approach Iraqis for food, and we don't know that they do it for any reason other than wanting better or even just different food than what they get on base, or even just to establish links with the locals. In other words, we really have no evidence at all of a food shortage, and the article seems to have studiously avoided actually making any direct claims to that effect. Which makes me think that there ISN'T a food shortage, even if the troops do hate the food (something that would not surprise me terribly).

 

[Luke T.]

I'd like to see a more reliable news source. One that I've heard of.

However, two meals a day for a Marine is UNSAT.

I've eaten the MRE's. High on carbs. Spaghetti. And they are not first class fare by a long shot. I imagine they would get pretty tiresome very quickly.

If there is a supply/logistics problem, that is very bad. If you can't get food to the troops, then you probably aren't getting them other supplies necessary to their survival should all hell break loose.

But you also have to keep in mind that for Marines on the move, food = weight. More stuff to carry.

Don't know. Need more info.

 

[Rob Lister]

I seriously doubt their eating MRE's except when on extended patrols.

Otherwise they'll eat 'regular army chow' in the mess tent.

It really ain't bad for the first week or so.

 

[Tony]

Not even a little bit. It is an extraordinary claim and requires extraordinary evidence.

Soldiers going hungry while fighting in war is an extraordinary claim? Excuse me while I laugh.

bwahahahahahahahhahahahahahhahahahahahaha

Ok, what else is an extraordinary claim? That soldiers sometimes get athletes foot?

 

[Ziggurat]

Soldiers going hungry while fighting in war is an extraordinary claim? Excuse me while I laugh.

That wasn't really the claim. The claim being disputed here is that there's a food shortage. And that DOES seem quite extraordinary at this point in the war. And as I pointed out, the article studiously avoids actually making that claim, but merely suggests it in ways which could be factually correct even if there were no food shortage. Why would that be, if there is a food shortage? Why wouldn't they just state that there's a food shortage?

Are you going to argue that there is a food shortage for troops in Iraq? Because I got enough of mere suggestions from the article, and would like to keep things explicit here.

 

[jj]

By the 1000th time you've had "Yankee Pot Roast" you've likely about had your fill.

On the other hand, when camping for long periods of time, even the dehyrated scrambled eggs start to taste good.

Still I'd like to hear from somebody in the field.

 

[Rob Lister]

You can do it JJ. I don't have any links handy but their are several Iraq Soldier blogs out there. Some are even critical or the situation. Do a google see what you come up with. If you come up empty, I'll ask a pal.

 

[jj]

You can do it JJ. I don't have any links handy but their are several Iraq Soldier blogs out there. Some are even critical or the situation. Do a google see what you come up with. If you come up empty, I'll ask a pal.

I'd prefer somebody I know, which will take a while.

 

[Tony]

That wasn't really the claim. The claim being disputed here is that there's a food shortage. And that DOES seem quite extraordinary at this point in the war. And as I pointed out, the article studiously avoids actually making that claim, but merely suggests it in ways which could be factually correct even if there were no food shortage.

No it doesn't. All it does is relay an anecdote of one soldier (and his unit) going hungry and asking his mom to send food.

Are you going to argue that there is a food shortage for troops in Iraq?

No. I just think the lengths you guys will go to re-enforce your beliefs are pathetic and laughable.

 

[Rob Lister]

No it doesn't. All it does is relay an anecdote of one soldier (and his unit) going hungry and asking his mom to send food.



No. I just think the lengths you guys will go to re-enforce your beliefs are pathetic and laughable.

I can't speak for others but the re-enforcement I get is from many years of experience. I find it highly, highly unlikely that our soldier's are being [medically] starved. Now, I'm sure some specific soldier's believe they're being starved because they are actually getting down to regulation weight and body fat.

 

[The Fool]

I can't speak for others but the re-enforcement I get is from many years of experience. I find it highly, highly unlikely that our soldier's are being [medically] starved. Now, I'm sure some specific soldier's believe they're being starved because they are actually getting down to regulation weight and body fat.

somewhere there will be warehouses full of tinned calories.....the problem is always getting it to the right people at the rights time. Infantry are always saddled with huge loads even before food is even considered...."It'll be driven up to you later" yea sure.....

Lets see if I can scrounge a kebab of that guy......