TPP Dead in the Water

This is the first thing he's done that I approve of.

Trade deals are, generally speaking, good things. This was not a trade deal, or rather, not just a trade deal. It was practically every corporatism-favoring bad idea that had been bandied about for the last decade, rolled into one secretive, festering pile.

https://www.eff.org/issues/tpp
 
Beelzebuddy said:
This is the first thing he's done that I approve of.

Trade deals are, generally speaking, good things. This was not a trade deal, or rather, not just a trade deal. It was practically every corporatism-favoring bad idea that had been bandied about for the last decade, rolled into one secretive, festering pile.

https://www.eff.org/issues/tpp
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That's what it looks like t me, but hey it's Trump, leftists have to be for TPP now.
 
The deal, like ttip, was slanted very much in the North Americans favour, good luck getting a better deal Donald.
 
logger said:
That's what it looks like t me, but hey it's Trump, leftists have to be for TPP now.
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No we don't; you're just reflecting your own binary thinking. Many (probably most) Democrats opposed the TPP because of the details, but not the general principle of trade agreements, and even Hillary came around to that position (although only after Bernie popularized the idea). Free trade is a neoliberal principle that some (e.g. Obama and both Clintons) -- but not all -- Democrats have embraced. I'd say most Democrats favor a position somewhere between Trump's protectionism and trade wars (which really will be a disaster if Congress doesn't prevent it) and the "giving away the store" that they thought TPP would be for American workers.
 
The part people hated, the ability for companies to sue countries, was probably it's best part. A shame it is gone.
 
George W. Bush was the best thing that ever happened to Iran.

And now, Donald J. Trump is on his way to be the best thing that has ever happened to China and to Russia.
 
As far as I can see the TPP was heavily slanted in favour of the US. However it's the other stuff Trump announced that's more worrying. Beside the reinstatement of the Mexico City he has proposed this:

Also on Monday morning, Mr Trump pledged to "massively" cut regulations and taxes on companies, but impose "a very major border tax" if they move factories outside the US...

...After meeting business leaders at the White House, Mr Trump pledged to lower corporate taxes to 15% or 20%, from the current 35%, and slash regulations by up to 75% if they keep jobs in the US.
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-38721056

And I'm sure his Blue Collar supporters will cheer, until they realize those regulations were the ones preventing their workplaces being turned into Third World sweatshops.
 
logger said:
That's what it looks like t me, but hey it's Trump, leftists have to be for TPP now.
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Protectionism is the insanity embraced by leftists, the Green Party as well as the hard right but the rest of us that are somewhere in the middle generally like free trade including our recent past presidents, both Republican and Democrat. Trump and Sanders are both protectionists.
 
WilliamSeger said:
No we don't; you're just reflecting your own binary thinking. Many (probably most) Democrats opposed the TPP because of the details, but not the general principle of trade agreements, and even Hillary came around to that position (although only after Bernie popularized the idea).
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Do you really believe that Hillary "came around to that position?" I agree more with portland atheist that opposition to the TPP (and NAFTA) come mostly from the crank left and crank right and that trade deals are generally supported by most people (although most of the passion is on the anti-free trade side). Hillary realized TPP was something she could abandon for now and pick up votes in the process (without losing a lot of support).
 
Brainster said:
Do you really believe that Hillary "came around to that position?" I agree more with portland atheist that opposition to the TPP (and NAFTA) come mostly from the crank left and crank right and that trade deals are generally supported by most people (although most of the passion is on the anti-free trade side). Hillary realized TPP was something she could abandon for now and pick up votes in the process (without losing a lot of support).
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Someone studied political promises and it showed politicians do surprisingly well at keeping promises.
 
I'm not sure the US pulling out means all of the other countries will follow suit. It was my understanding if we didn't take the lead in the TPP, China would.
 
Brainster said:
Do you really believe that Hillary "came around to that position?" I agree more with portland atheist that opposition to the TPP (and NAFTA) come mostly from the crank left and crank right and that trade deals are generally supported by most people (although most of the passion is on the anti-free trade side). Hillary realized TPP was something she could abandon for now and pick up votes in the process (without losing a lot of support).
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Interesting that the GOP leadership in the Senate has already fired a shot over Trump's bow ,warning him they will have be involved in any renegotiating with other countries over NAFTA.
I am making a prediction: In about six months time the words President Pence are going to start sounding very good to a lot of Republicans.
I also read that although they are putting up a supportive face in public, behind closed doors a Lot of the Republicans in Congress are appalled by Trump's behavior in the first few days of office.
 
Brainster said:
Do you really believe that Hillary "came around to that position?" I agree more with portland atheist that opposition to the TPP (and NAFTA) come mostly from the crank left and crank right and that trade deals are generally supported by most people (although most of the passion is on the anti-free trade side). Hillary realized TPP was something she could abandon for now and pick up votes in the process (without losing a lot of support).
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Yes, I really believe that she came around to the "position" that she would not support TPP, for nuanced reasons (and to appeal to Bernie supporters no doubt), but that doesn't mean she converted to protectionism -- she definitely didn't, nor did she claim to. So it is possible she would go for a different trade agreement if she could claim it met her criteria for creating jobs and raising wages.
 
WilliamSeger said:
Yes, I really believe that she came around to the "position" that she would not support TPP, for nuanced reasons (and to appeal to Bernie supporters no doubt), but that doesn't mean she converted to protectionism -- she definitely didn't, nor did she claim to. So it is possible she would go for a different trade agreement if she could claim it met her criteria for creating jobs and raising wages.
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If you mean she would have slapped some lipstick (cosmetic changes) on TPP and declared it beautiful, I agree.
 
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