• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Three Parents Allowed in Canada!

qayak

Penultimate Amazing
qayak
Joined
Jul 31, 2006
Messages
13,844
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070103/od_uk_nm/oukoe_uk_parents

TORONTO (Reuters) - A five-year-old Canadian boy can have two mothers and a father, an Ontario court ruled this week in a landmark case that redefines the meaning of family and examines the rights of parents in same-sex relationships.

In a ruling released on Tuesday, the Ontario Court of Appeal said the female partner of the child's biological mother could be legally recognised as the boy's third parent.

The biological father, named on the boy's birth certificate, is a friend of both women and is taking an active role in the child's life.

"It is contrary to (the child's) best interests that he is deprived of the legal recognition of the parentage of one of his mothers," Justice Marc Rosenberg wrote in the ruling, which did not name the three parents or the child.

"Perhaps one of the greatest fears faced by lesbian mothers is the death of the birth mother... Without a declaration of parentage or some other order, the surviving partner would be unable to make decisions for their minor child."

The two women, who have been together since 1990, told the court they did not want to adopt the child because it meant the father would lose his status as a parent.

"It's an important precedent because the legislature has not kept the legislation up to date," said Peter Jervis, one of the lawyers for the applicant, referred to only as "A.A."

"The court has basically said that it would step in to recognise this woman as the mother of her child ... and would treat her equally," said Jervis.

He added that the court found the family to be a very loving one and that A.A. had met all the criteria of being a loving mother.

"She read the bedtime stories, put the Band-Aids on his fingers, cleaned his runny nose, had taken him off to school," said Jervis.

The Alliance for Marriage and Family, a coalition of several groups that promote a traditional family structure, had filed as an intervenor in the case.

"We think there are many good reasons for continuing to uphold the definition of family as two parents," said Joanne McGarry, executive director of the Catholic Civil Rights League, one of the groups represented by the alliance.

"Once you remove it from the realm of nature and the realm of traditional moral and religious teachings, who's going to decide how many parents a child can have? What's so magical about three, maybe there could be more."

McGarry said the Alliance had not decided if it would appeal the decision.

The Institute for Canadian Values, which opposes a 2005 law allowing same-sex marriage in Canada, dismissed the ruling as an act of "naked judicial activism".

"The court saw this case as an opportunity to entrench so-called alternative family structures in law without submitting the idea to the rigours of the legislative process," Executive Director Joseph Ben-Ami said in a statement.

However, Laurel Rothman, Director of Social Reform at the Family Services Association of Toronto, which worked with the applicant's legal counsel during the case, applauded the decision.

"The situation basically recognises the changing face of families in Canada in the beginning of the twenty-first century," said Rothman.

"The law is catching up to the reality of families in modern-day Ontario."

Same-sex marriage has been legal in Ontario since 2003, and across Canada since 2005.

The latest judgement overturned a 2003 ruling by the Ontario Superior Court of Justice in which the judge found that he did not have jurisdiction to declare the woman a mother.
Click to expand...
 
Sweet. I've always supported customized family structures, even though I'm happy with plain ol monogamy. There'll be some issues with insurance and workplace benefits and all that, but hopefully it'll shake out in the end.
 
quixotecoyote said:
Sweet. I've always supported customized family structures, even though I'm happy with plain ol monogamy. There'll be some issues with insurance and workplace benefits and all that, but hopefully it'll shake out in the end.
Click to expand...

This caught my eye:

"We think there are many good reasons for continuing to uphold the definition of family as two parents," said Joanne McGarry, executive director of the Catholic Civil Rights League, one of the groups represented by the alliance.

"Once you remove it from the realm of nature and the realm of traditional moral and religious teachings, who's going to decide how many parents a child can have? What's so magical about three, maybe there could be more."

I think that an automatic case could be made for the spouse of the father. So, yes, there could be more. :Banane59:
 
My initial reaction was, 'weird'. On consideration, it stayed the same.

I've no objection. Whatever. I see no harm.

My dirty mind only asks, who sleeps where?

ETA: to spoon or be spoon is no longer the question, it is the answer with 'or' replaced by 'and'.
 
I like how nature somehow says two parents are best. Is there some way we can contact nature to verify this.

I also like how religious teachings hold value because they are traditional. I wonder if she'd defend other 'traditional' teaching society has abandoned.
 
Rob Lister said:
My initial reaction was, 'weird'. On consideration, it stayed the same.

I've no objection. Whatever. I see no harm.

My dirty mind only asks, who sleeps where?

ETA: to spoon or be spoon is no longer the question, it is the answer with 'or' replaced by 'and'.
Click to expand...
You're jumping to conclusions, Rob. Maybe it was an in vitro fertilization.

That said, I like your dirty mind. Think we can make it a fivesome? :) 'Jes kidding. I, like you, go along with Chick Hearn: "No harm, no foul."
 
quixotecoyote said:
I like how nature somehow says two parents are best. Is there some way we can contact nature to verify this.
Click to expand...

You know, for some reason I can't help thinking about elephants right now.
They have a matriarchal society with herds made up from solely calfs and females with the odd male popping in from time to time when one of the females are in heat.
Multiple mothers. No males. And young 'uns perfectly fitting into elephant "society".
Was that nature I just heard mumbling something about idiots and selective hearing?
 
Well, I'm convinced, if the elephants do it!

They also use their noses to drink but that's another issue... :p
 
Darth Rotor said:
At the risk of slippery sloping here, it appears that some old school Mormons can start heading to Canada soon, and return to a traditional practice of polygamy.
Click to expand...

Well, only if they are unable to distinguish parenting from marriage.

Granted, given some of the arguments against gay marriage, some people apparently are NOT able to distinguish parenting from marriage, so they would be thick enough to try it.

There is no slipperly slope here. The two concepts are readily separated.
 
I think it all ought to be contractual.

Contract a father, for sperm and/or fathership, and/or spousal relationship, or sex.

Contract a mother for eggs, gestation, mothership, spousal relationship,or sex.

Contract whoever you want, however many you want, for as long as you want.

Hey, if pre-nups and palimony are legal, why not?

The lawyers ought to love it.
 
qayak said:
"We think there are many good reasons for continuing to uphold the definition of family as two parents," said Joanne McGarry, executive director of the Catholic Civil Rights League, one of the groups represented by the alliance.

"Once you remove it from the realm of nature and the realm of traditional moral and religious teachings, who's going to decide how many parents a child can have? What's so magical about three, maybe there could be more."
Click to expand...
I'm amused that the executive director of the Catholic Civil Rights League doesn't see anything magical about three or, one might call it, a trinity.

eta: my godsons arguably have four parents.
 
Upchurch said:
I'm amused that the executive director of the Catholic Civil Rights League doesn't see anything magical about three or, one might call it, a trinity.
Click to expand...

I'm amused that they refer to it as a Civil Rights League. You don't often see a civil rights org. arguing against people getting MORE rights!
 
Darth Rotor said:
At the risk of slippery sloping here, it appears that some old school Mormons can start heading to Canada soon, and return to a traditional practice of polygamy.
Click to expand...

They're already here, and we can't seem to do anything about them.

Google for "Bountiful" (the name of the town) and "polygamy" for lots of cites.
 
Probably good for the kid except if the parents split up- whereupon he may be shuffled between three homes!
 
I wonder if the man is one of the petitioning parties. Regardless of one's opinion of three parents, I think that all reasonable people can agree that no judge has the right to unilaterally make decisions on the matter. I also wonder about this quote: "a landmark case that redefines the meaning of family and examines the rights of parents in same-sex relationships." What does same-sex have to do with it? Would it have been different if the biological mother had wanted to have her husband declared a parent?

Pardalis said:
Well, I'm convinced, if the elephants do it!
Click to expand...
We're not elephants. And in among elephants, there are still exactly two parents. Ther are more than two caregivers.

They also use their noses to drink but that's another issue... :p
Click to expand...
To be precise, they use their noses in drinking. They don't, as some people seem to believe, drink through their noses.

quixotecoyote said:
I like how nature somehow says two parents are best.
Click to expand...
Nature doesn't say that two parents is best. Nature says that two is the only number.

I also like how religious teachings hold value because they are traditional. I wonder if she'd defend other 'traditional' teaching society has abandoned.
Click to expand...
I like how people are so closeminded as to ignore basic logic when defending their prejudices. Obviously, there is a difference between recognizing that something holds value and defending it.
 
Art Vandelay said:
I also wonder about this quote: "a landmark case that redefines the meaning of family and examines the rights of parents in same-sex relationships." What does same-sex have to do with it? Would it have been different if the biological mother had wanted to have her husband declared a parent?
Click to expand...

I think the implication is that this type of situation is far more likely to occur in same sex marriages.

Nature doesn't say that two parents is best. Nature says that two is the only number.
Click to expand...

Some interesting thoughts on this:

http://www.dnacenter.com/media/twins-different-fathers.html

http://www.psu.edu/ur/2002/twofathers.html
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom