Solar Flares

[Eos of the Eons]

I need help, since as per usual, google is only giving me crap and for some reason I can't find if Phil Plait has addressed this.

I had someone ask me if a solar flare could wipe out earth. I feel the earth is too far away for one solar flare to ever wipe us out. Sure, we can feel some effects, and see the brilliant aurora's if it is not too cloudy (like it was here a few weeks ago so I missed it, augh!).

How strong could a solar flare get, and could it ever take us out with a direct hit (energy blasting us)?

 

[bokonon]

The sun is less than a million miles in diameter. We are 93 million miles away. For a solar flare to reach us, therefore, it would have to extend more than 100 times the width of the sun. That won't happen.

The electromagnetic energy from a solar flare may knock out electronic equipment, and cause mutations in exposed DNA, but it isn't going to wipe out the earth.

 

[Michael Mozina]

The sun is less than a million miles in diameter. We are 93 million miles away. For a solar flare to reach us, therefore, it would have to extend more than 100 times the width of the sun. That won't happen.

The electromagnetic energy from a solar flare may knock out electronic equipment, and cause mutations in exposed DNA, but it isn't going to wipe out the earth.

I agree. The EM and particle hit of a large CME might wipe out satellites in space and ground based electronics but I doubt it would have much effect on lifeforms on Earth. To wipe us off the planet would require a sustained hit over an extremely long time and flares are typically limited duration events.

 

[shadron]

Assuming you mean to include the Coronal Mass Ejection which often accompanies a solar flare...

Before the advent of electricity solar flares and their CMEs were known only for their bright auroral displays, and in fact the cause of the displays was unknown. They had no other effect upon the Earth or it's life.

The great solar flare of 1859 was noted for it's huge auroral displays and for its effects upon telegraph lines. See the description here: http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2008/06may_carringtonflare/

 

[Towlie]

The electromagnetic energy from a solar flare may knock out electronic equipment, and cause mutations in exposed DNA, but it isn't going to wipe out the earth.

What a great idea for a science fiction monster movie! I wonder if it's been done yet.

 

[Eos of the Eons]

Awesome, thank you! I read this one dumbe site that claimed it COULD wipe out all life on earth if big and direct enough, and people are affected emotionally and physically by them. Ugh. My warning bells went off when it claimed there are more break ups and such nonsense when a solar flare goes off. I will look for it, and invite debunkings for our entertainment

http://www.nasca.org.uk/Strange_Maps/solar/Solar_Flare/solar_flare.html

Solar flares are directly linked to other celestial phenomenon such as planetary alignments. For instance this current spate of Solar activity has occurred at a time when the Sun is ringed with aligned planets. To us this is not a coincidence, and it is our belief that once these aligning planets disperse to less influential positions then Solar activity will once again return to normal levels. The risk remains however that perhaps one day an alignment will arise capable of triggering a Solar Armaggeddon against which we shall have no defence at all.

Sometimes I hates the internets. Oh, and some religious sites claim this will be the cause of armegeddon... god has it armed and ready for us evil sinners... so we better behave or he will use the sun this way... solar flare armegeddon!

 

[Crazycowbob]

I think Phil did cover this in his latest book, "Death from the Skies", unfortunately, I've loaned it to a friend so can not check right now. A really good read though, you should get it if you're into this kind of thing!

 

[Eos of the Eons]

I think Phil did cover this in his latest book, "Death from the Skies", unfortunately, I've loaned it to a friend so cannot check right now. A realy good read though, you should get it if you're into this kind of thing!

Go figure, I just have his other book. I love anything by him and about him... /stalker mode

 

[Crazycowbob]

Go figure, I just have his other book. I love anything by him and about him... /stalker mode

Not going to fault you there! I was going to hunt him down and beg him to sign my copy at the shuttle launch in feb. but he said he wasn't going, so I'm going to have to hunt him down somewhere else. You know, Boulder really isn't THAT far from Lubbock...

 

[Towlie]

I wouldn't hesitate to bet my life savings that a solar flare will never wipe out life on Earth.

In fact, I'll bet my life savings that nothing will ever wipe out life on Earth.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Awesome, thank you! I read this one dumbe site that claimed it COULD wipe out all life on earth if big and direct enough, and people are affected emotionally and physically by them. Ugh. My warning bells went off when it claimed there are more break ups and such nonsense when a solar flare goes off. I will look for it, and invite debunkings for our entertainment

http://www.nasca.org.uk/Strange_Maps/solar/Solar_Flare/solar_flare.html






Sometimes I hates the internets. Oh, and some religious sites claim this will be the cause of armegeddon... god has it armed and ready for us evil sinners... so we better behave or he will use the sun this way... solar flare armegeddon!

NASA is misspelled in that link.


I'm a solar flare fan. There's some great educational stuff on the space weather and SOHO sites.

http://sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov/spaceweather/

The links from the SOHO site are chock full of cool stuff. Spaceweather has a nice summary of solar activity updated daily.

http://www.spaceweather.com/

 

[ServiceSoon]

As long as the earth’s magnetic field stays constant, I don’t believe there is any evidence to suggest that a coronal mass ejection would destroy life on earth. However, there have been studies that show the earths polarity reverses. If the earth was to be hit with a blast from the sun while this transition was taking place, and thus leaving the earth vulnerable to the solar wind, etc, destruction of life on earth could occur.

I wouldn't hesitate to bet my life savings that a solar flare will never wipe out life on Earth.

In fact, I'll bet my life savings that nothing will ever wipe out life on Earth.

You think you’re pretty clever

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

If you think about it, the Sun has been ejecting large CMEs toward Earth for 4.5 billion years, (the age of the Earth). Life's been around for more than 3.5 billion years, (the earliest fossil record of life). We have had major extinctions during that time, none that wiped out "all life". Some of the extinction causes are known or strongly supported by the evidence. A gamma ray burst from a nearby supernova is one proposed mechanism for one of the extinction events but not one that there is a consensus about. No solar CMEs are implicated for any of the major events.

But the Earth's magnetic field reverses on a regular basis. During a reversal it is possible the Earth is more vulnerable to a CME hit than when the field is protecting us. So it is possible that a very large CME (coronal mass ejection that accompanies a solar flare) scoring a direct hit on the Earth during the time the magnetic field is disorganized during a pole reversal, could certainly cause the mass death of some organisms. It would not wipe out all life because lots of organisms would be shielded. And having the two relatively rare events occurring together could be so rare that it happens less often than every 4.5 billion years.

Just saying....

 

[Eos of the Eons]

NASA is misspelled in that link.


I'm a solar flare fan. There's some great educational stuff on the space weather and SOHO sites.

http://sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov/spaceweather/

The links from the SOHO site are chock full of cool stuff. Spaceweather has a nice summary of solar activity updated daily.

http://www.spaceweather.com/

Oh, I totally knew it was a BS site and not related to NASA at all, it just made me sad when I read what was on it.

Ohhhh, thank you for the links!

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Oh, I totally knew it was a BS site and not related to NASA at all, ...

I knew you knew.

 

[shadron]

As long as the earth’s magnetic field stays constant, I don’t believe there is any evidence to suggest that a coronal mass ejection would destroy life on earth. However, there have been studies that show the earths polarity reverses. If the earth was to be hit with a blast from the sun while this transition was taking place, and thus leaving the earth vulnerable to the solar wind, etc, destruction of life on earth could occur.

You think you’re pretty clever

The current theory about pole reversals doesn't include as a major part the reduction of the field strength to zero. Rather, it involves local disoganization of the field, so that there are essentially a plethora of north and south poles in the middle time. That we see single north and south poles apparently is just a measure of the more usual alignment of local fields.

That implies that we will still have some shielding from CMEs and proton radiation even while the poles are switching. I would imagine that auroras would become a universal rather than polar phenomenon, and that there is more danger for individuals that happen to find themselves between fields. However, I note that no one has blamed any of the mass extinction events on the sun that I am aware of.

 

[bokonon]

I would imagine that auroras would become a universal rather than polar phenomenon

So, something to look forward to.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

The current theory about pole reversals doesn't include as a major part the reduction of the field strength to zero.

Do you have any sources for this? I thought it had been hypothesized that loss of the field could indeed occur during the shift, as well as an ineffective field for years even millennia during the shift.

 

[ServiceSoon]

The current theory about pole reversals doesn't include as a major part the reduction of the field strength to zero. Rather, it involves local disoganization of the field, so that there are essentially a plethora of north and south poles in the middle time. That we see single north and south poles apparently is just a measure of the more usual alignment of local fields.

That implies that we will still have some shielding from CMEs and proton radiation even while the poles are switching. I would imagine that auroras would become a universal rather than polar phenomenon, and that there is more danger for individuals that happen to find themselves between fields. However, I note that no one has blamed any of the mass extinction events on the sun that I am aware of.

What causes the earth to produce a magnetic field? Hot molten lava rotating in the earth. For the poles to flip this rotation has to change direction. For that to happen it would have to stop, and start again..no that couldn't work. It wouldn't stop rotating and then start again. I don't believe that the laws of nature allow that. I think the reversal would occur by the north pole moving south on one side of the planet, and the south pole moving north on the opposite side.

Got it. All the drawings I've seen show the magnetic field from the south shooting away from the north and eventually coming back around half circle to the north. Pic.

Currently the CME's hit the earth close to the center of the north and south poles, where the strength is the strongest? What if the pole was facing the sun, would it's protective properties be decreased?

 

[shadron]

Do you have any sources for this? I thought it had been hypothesized that loss of the field could indeed occur during the shift, as well as an ineffective field for years even millennia during the shift.

A start: Geomagnetic excursion^WP