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Quantum Mechanics and Psi

JKDChick

New Blood
J
Joined
Oct 6, 2003
Messages
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I'm having a little bit of a war with a kid at "Sanctuary of Development" (I have way too much free time) about chi and psionics.

He'd got the usual just enough information to be really, really stupid. He's trying to use the old QM justifies psi cop out. but he's never heard of the change at distance theory. I made the mistake of mentioning it and now he's jumped on THAT bandwagon too.

So, since I'm finding it boring to repeat the same things all the time, can anyone out there provide me with some new material? Any studies about this I don't know about? Any new angles I might have missed?

By the way, he also claims that if you can focus your chi, you can throw a punch at 80 MPH.
 
Uh, no actually. "Zero Distance Striking" is just a matter of practise and proper form, my Sifu can do it. I can sorta do it, but since I'm a competing martial artist, it's not really a high priority. It has nothing to do with chi.

The martial arts aspect is just a side line.

I'm talking about any scientific studies around the world that have dealt with Quantum Mechanics as the transmission of psi powers and the debunking of same.
 
JKDChick said:
I'm talking about any scientific studies around the world that have dealt with Quantum Mechanics as the transmission of psi powers and the debunking of same.
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I'm not sure how relevant this abstract here is to your query, but it contains the immortal line:
Homeopathy could be a macroscopic analogue to quantum teleportation.
Click to expand...
:dl:

Rolfe.
 
Having had a look at the thread...

http://kiwarrior400000.proboards23....neral&num=1074464786&action=display&start=150

... both of you have roughly the right ideas on the basic physics buy you are both often meaning slightly different things, like when ElementKeeper is talking about particle/antiparticle creation and annihiliation and you're talking about quantum entanglement. ElementKeeper's conclusions based on these ideas were obviously more than a little wild, though. ;)

If someone claims to have an 80 MPH punch, then maybe they should videotape themselves punching a tennis ball to test that claim. Hang the ball from a thread and line it up with a meter stick or meter markings on a wall. Someone lets go of the thread as the person punches the ball. See how many frames per second the camera records at and how many frames it takes for the ball to travel a meter or whatever distance per time the camera caught.

I think I'd just ask awkward questions or think up simple tests like the one above of their claims and just ignore any attempt of people to bring quantum physics, spiritual ideas, etc. into it. It saves you time and effort. :)
 
Ask him if he can walk through walls and if he becomes a wave when he moves. If the answer to either of these questions is no he is not behaving like a quantum object.
 
Originally posted by JKDChick
I'm talking about any scientific studies around the world that have dealt with Quantum Mechanics as the transmission of psi powers and the debunking of same.
Click to expand...

There's probably not going to be any, for two reasons: first, quantum mechanics doesn't predict any psionic abilities, so there's no reason to go searching. People can do whatever handwaving arguments they want about analogies to whatever they want, but quantum mechanics is a quantitative science, and it makes quantitative predictions, and nobody has or ever will be able to make a quantitative prediction from QM for psionic abilities. A lot of people get lost in the whole wave-particle duality, various interpretations, etc. and lose sight of the fact that we don't believe in quantum mechanics because of these qualitative aspects, we believe in it because the numbers it gives (such as for atomic spectra) are amazingly acurate. If you can't produce the numbers, it's all just useless handwaving.

But second, and perhaps even more importantly, why look for any kind of explanation for a phenomena that no one has ever even shown exists? Showing psionic phenomena exist is rather a more fundamental problem than trying to explain it with an existing theory. And since no one can do that, why bother hunting for an explanation?
 
Just as a point, fastballs by professional pitchers have been clocked at 90 mph. That would mean their pitching hand was moving at at least 90 mph when the ball was released. So an 80 mph puch doesn't sound all that far out of bounds.

Of course, as far as I know, baseball pitchers don't claim that throwing a fastball involves focusing your chi. ;)
 
Ziggurat said:
Showing psionic phenomena exist is rather a more fundamental problem than trying to explain it with an existing theory. And since no one can do that, why bother hunting for an explanation?
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:)

Really, what more needs to be said?
 
espritch said:
Just as a point, fastballs by professional pitchers have been clocked at 90 mph. That would mean their pitching hand was moving at at least 90 mph when the ball was released. So an 80 mph puch doesn't sound all that far out of bounds.

Of course, as far as I know, baseball pitchers don't claim that throwing a fastball involves focusing your chi. ;)
Click to expand...

Oh, man, EVERYONE brings that one up ...

Just for reference, my father is a professional pitching coach, so I'm up on this topic a bit.

Yes, AT THE MOMENT OF RELEASE, a pitcher's hand is moving at the speed of the pitch .... here's the major difference:

A punch, a proper boxing punch, travels from about 6 inches to maybe a foot from inception to contact point, on a relatively straight line.

A pitcher torques their whole body and winds up into a pitch, generating power with their legs and using the added leverage that SEVERAL FEET of throwing room gives them. Yes, a punch thrown in this manner would be travelling at 80 miles per hour when it made contact. You'd be dead or bleeding by then, since your opponent would have hit you a few dozen times before your punch landed, of course. Also, not so many people can do this, which is why pitchers get lots of money.

No human can accelerate their hand to 80 MPH in 6 to 12 inches. The fastest clocked time was around 50 MPH, still very fast.

Thanks for the links guys. Please keep'em coming if you have more.
 
Back in the '70's my Sensei had a master by the name of Bill Wallace aka superfoot. His kick was clocked at 60MPH. This has nothing to do with QM but shows rather that certain people are astounding athletes.

edit:brain fart
 
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