More irresponsible reporting on guns.

[Ranb]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/05/12/ndaa-guns_n_7265184.html

Psst. Want an untraceable gun? Courtesy of Congress and the U.S. military?

That may soon be possible thanks to a provision tacked onto this year's National Defense Authorization Act, which the House of Representatives is set to pass this week.

According to a white paper prepared for Congress by the Army opposing the amendment, the measure would allow the unregulated distribution of up to 100,000 Colt .45s, more formally known as .45-caliber semiautomatic M1911 handguns.

The "white paper" is here; http://big.assets.huffingtonpost.com/CMPInfoPaper11May.pdf

The white paper does not describe the transfer process as unregulated as the above article claims.
It does accurately claim that the CMP is not required to maintain the same records as an FFL.
The CMP does a NICS check for each person ordering any firearm from them; there is some regulation.
These pistols do have serial numbers, they are not untraceable as claimed.

This claim is legitimate as far as I know;

The Army noted in its opposition that the Department of Justice has tracked an average of nearly 1,800 Colt .45s being used in crimes every year over the last decade, including a significant but unspecified number of those guns that were originally military surplus.

Ranb

 

[dudalb]

Gun Control is an issue where both sides are perfectly happy to Lie like crazy if they think it will advance their cause.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

Only the Army would describe the M1911 as "concealable."

 

[BStrong]

Only the Army would describe the M1911 as "concealable."

It's nice and flat (less wide than a Glock or HK in .45) and carries quite well concealed in anything short of beach wear, and the shorter versions (4.25", 4", 3.5" barrels) are even better.

Considering how many millions of military and civilian 1911 platform pistols have been turned out since 1911, I'm surprised at the figure of only 1,800 per year used in crime, but criminals are not usually noted for being very gun savvy.

 

[casebro]

I'd love to buy one. Mine is a civilian model by a different mfg.

I believe they are all pre- 1946. Not many purchased since then, they were rebuild and re-issued until the M-9 replaced them, and never were obsoleted. There is a recent new contract with slight upgrades, I think it is the M-45a2?

The design never went obsolete, I'm not sure why the Army wants to sell them off. But I've got my check book handy. But I have a hard time believing that they will ever sell a semi auto pistol to the public.

For those who don't know, the CMP is the Civilian Marksmanship Program. I think of it as the official way to supply the "well regulated (supplied) Militia" . It makes money for the government through the sale of surplus firearms. Most have been WWII era and before- like this instance. Last I heard the M-1 Garands they had were going for up to $1500 each. I suspect these pistols that cost $38 in 1944 will go for at least $500 per.

 

[Ranb]

I believe they are all pre- 1946. Not many purchased since then, they were rebuild and re-issued until the M-9 replaced them, and never were obsoleted. There is a recent new contract with slight upgrades, I think it is the M-45a2?

I imagine that they are rather worn out with a sloppy frame/slide fit. Safe to use but probably inaccurate. Would be nice if I'm wrong.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_Marksmanship_Program

http://thecmp.org/ http://thecmp.org/cmp_sales/sales-faq/

Q?
If you receive a “Delay” from the FBI, why do you not process the order after three days, as authorized by law?

A.
First- we are not your regular gun dealer. The law that established the CMP exempted us from FFL requirements. We are not required to keep a 'book' or to ship only to another FFL. The law also specifies that we must have a completed 'successful' background check conducted for each sale. So - we cannot ship a rifle until we get a 'proceed' from the FBI. The three days after a 'delay' does not apply to us as it does to FFL licensed dealers. We can also ship direct to your home, where dealers cannot.

Second - the NICS check submission to the FBI provides no information about the firearm - no model, no serial number, nothing. It only provides the information about the individual.

Ranb

 

[casebro]

It's nice and flat (less wide than a Glock or HK in .45) and carries quite well concealed in anything short of beach wear, and the shorter versions (4.25", 4", 3.5" barrels) are even better.

Considering how many millions of military and civilian 1911 platform pistols have been turned out since 1911, I'm surprised at the figure of only 1,800 per year used in crime, but criminals are not usually noted for being very gun savvy.

I have some doubts about the 1800 number. Was it "1911 ACP style pistols" which come in other calibers too, or was it "pistols of .45 caliber, including other designs even revolvers" ?

Colt was only um the 3rd largest manufacturer for the government. Remington-Rand made more. Singer sewing machine even made 500, very rare.

I familiarized myself just yesterday, after handling a buddy's 1914 production one. It was his Dad's issue weapon, he served from 1939 to retirement. That gun was 25 years old before issue to him, and 45 years old and still in service. History on your hip.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

My National Guard M16A12 was made in '72 or '73 by GM Hydramatic Division - normally known for automatic transmissions.

 

[BStrong]

I have some doubts about the 1800 number. Was it "1911 ACP style pistols" which come in other calibers too, or was it "pistols of .45 caliber, including other designs even revolvers" ?

Colt was only um the 3rd largest manufacturer for the government. Remington-Rand made more. Singer sewing machine even made 500, very rare.

I familiarized myself just yesterday, after handling a buddy's 1914 production one. It was his Dad's issue weapon, he served from 1939 to retirement.

Generically, folks that aren't right with the program will call every 1911 a Colt and likewise with M16's. Every lever action they see is a "Winchester" and every bolt rifle is a "30-06" - there's a few fun internet meme's that show various firearms of different types and each firearm is described as a Glock, AK or AR.

Show most of the above types of folks a Singer 1911, a Rock-Ola M1 carbine, an International Harvester M1 Garand or a General Motors Hydramatic Division 16 and they'll flip their wig.

 

[BStrong]

My National Guard M16A12 was made in '72 or '73 by GM Hydramatic Division - normally known for automatic transmissions.

A whole bunch of the GM 16's ended up DX'd and the receivers ended up as demilled halves back in the late 70's early 80's - a guy by the name of John Norrel who was/is a licensed SOT

http://www.johnnorrellarms.com/

Was one of the first guys to reweld demilled 16 lowers into transferable live guns.

 

[CORed]

International Harvester M1 Garand

I bet those rust out really bad starting at the rear wheel wells.

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

Lol! I bought a scout once. Coulda dropped a basketball on the right rear through the hole I found under painted pegboard and fridge-box wrapped in plastic. I "fixed" it silicon sealant and a misprinted real estate sign pop riveted to the remaining "steel." Put the pegboard back on and had me a summer!

 

[ponderingturtle]

Only the Army would describe the M1911 as "concealable."

Bonnie of Bonnie and Clyde fame did sneak one into a police station get out, and at 4'11" and 90 lbs that seems pretty concealable in practice.

 

[Bikewer]

We have graphic video of an arrested subject who's brought in to the breathalizer room in a police station and left alone for a minute... He very calmly removes a full-sized .45 Auto from his pants (he's a big guy) and shoots himself....
With a good rig and good clothing choice, "old slabsides" is perfectly concealable and has a great following to this day...Most all major manufacturers turn out a "clone" of some sort due to the patent protection having long since expired.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Bonnie of Bonnie and Clyde fame did sneak one into a police station get out, and at 4'11" and 90 lbs that seems pretty concealable in practice.

I've never seen a pistol that was 4'11" tall.

 

[Ranb]

I sent Mike McAuliff an e-mail highlighting the errors in his article and suggesting it was meant to be satire. I wonder if he will reply?

Ranb

 

[Howie Felterbush]

I imagine that they are rather worn out with a sloppy frame/slide fit.

So, like new?

 

[Trebuchet]

I imagine that they are rather worn out with a sloppy frame/slide fit. Safe to use but probably inaccurate. Would be nice if I'm wrong. b

I was under the impression that they were inaccurate starting from 1911 on. One of the guys in my army unit managed to miss his foot from just four feet away while on CQ (charge of quarters) duty one night. The previous CQ had been cycling the ammo through (for no apparent reason) and had racked the slide one time too few.

My National Guard M16A12 was made in '72 or '73 by GM Hydramatic Division - normally known for automatic transmissions.

Mine (in Basic) was also from GM, but a bit earlier, 1971. Half the 'cruits didn't think it was a real weapon, because, you know, plastic.

 

[12AX7]

I imagine that they are rather worn out with a sloppy frame/slide fit. Safe to use but probably inaccurate. Would be nice if I'm wrong.




Ranb

The 1911 I practiced with in the Army was so sloppy you could lock yourself in a bathroom with a dozen magazines and not hit the sink (and this was 1990). Then we went to the Beretta shortly after.

I was under the impression that they were inaccurate starting from 1911 on. One of the guys in my army unit managed to miss his foot from just four feet away while on CQ (charge of quarters) duty one night.

I don't doubt that at all.

Truth be told, the only firearm that would re-ignite my shooting urges is a Colt Series 70 1911.

Ranb; you know I'm sincere in this statement.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

My National Guard M16A12 was made in '72 or '73 by GM Hydramatic Division - normally known for automatic transmissions.

Formerly Borg-Warner?