Mars, Phoenix and ID "theory"

[Bodhi Dharma Zen]

I wonder, what would happen to religion, in general, and to ID in particular, if evidence of life is to be found on Mars?

That will end, forever, the strange idea about the Earth being "a special place" which god selected to create life...

Or believers will just say that it is another "proof"??

For me, ID holds the idea of a "personal will", that this "intelligent being" decided at some point to create life, but that is weird, to say the least.

Anyway, I just wanted to know what do you all feel?

 

[John Bentley]

It would depend on how closely related the life was to life here on earth. If it happened to have DNA, then it would certainly go a long way toward the idea that life possibly didn't originate on Earth.

Doesn't Watson, of DNA discovery fame, posit this? Or is it Crick?

ETA
I don't see how it would negate the ID'ers, except that it would have to be concluded that Earth wasn't unique in the development of life. Still wouldn't answer the question of where it came from. Of course, they would say "Well, Earth is still special. After all, there's no life on Mars now, is there?"

 

[jmercer]

Well... fwiw, the RCC has already addressed this issue. They believe that intelligent life found other than on earth would still be "God's Creation", and would have a soul. More troubling to them - and hotly under debate - is the question of original sin applying or not.

 

[John Bentley]

Well... fwiw, the RCC has already addressed this issue. They believe that intelligent life found other than on earth would still be "God's Creation", and would have a soul. More troubling to them - and hotly under debate - is the question of original sin applying or not.

Oh for crying out loud! What's next? How many "Martian" angels can dance on the head of a "Martian" pin? Would they want to send missionaries? I suppose so.

 

[apoger]

If life were found on another planet... the faithful would almost instantly find quotes in their holy book that predicted it. Their ability to rationalize is staggering.

 

[John Bentley]

If life were found on another planet... the faithful would almost instantly find quotes in their holy book that predicted it. Their ability to rationalize is staggering.

Just ask the UFO'ers. They've been saying biblical passages point to alien visitors for years now. "Wheels within wheels" and all that.

 

[chance]

Lets just hope it’s not like this:

Tuesday morning on the White House lawn

“Greeting Earth people, we come in peace ……… and to spread the word of the one true god, revealed to our ancestors ………your mortal souls are in danger ……. come and give thanks and reject the false prophets of your world ……….”

 

[Bodhi Dharma Zen]

Well... fwiw, the RCC has already addressed this issue. They believe that intelligent life found other than on earth would still be "God's Creation", and would have a soul. More troubling to them - and hotly under debate - is the question of original sin applying or not.

Amazing. Voltaire would be delighted, and very sad to see that after so many years, believers continue to believe...

 

[Bodhi Dharma Zen]

Lets just hope it’s not like this:

Tuesday morning on the White House lawn

“Greeting Earth people, we come in peace ……… and to spread the word of the one true god, revealed to our ancestors ………your mortal souls are in danger ……. come and give thanks and reject the false prophets of your world ……….”

I certainly HOPE that would not the case!

 

[fishbob]

For me, ID holds the idea of a "personal will", that this "intelligent being" decided at some point to create life, but that is weird, to say the least.

Where did you find this definition of ID? I checked the major websites like Answers in Genesis, Discovery Institute, Institute for Creation Research - none seems to have a clear statement of what ID theory is.

I have yet to see an actual ID theory that does not mention evolution. I see a lot of something like 'ID Theory proposes that some stuff is too complicated for evolution to have produced'.

 

[Bodhi Dharma Zen]

It is something implicit, even if they present just "one side" of it.

 

[AWPrime]

Re: Re: Mars, Phoenix and ID "theory"

Where did you find this definition of ID? I checked the major websites like Answers in Genesis, Discovery Institute, Institute for Creation Research - none seems to have a clear statement of what ID theory is.

I have yet to see an actual ID theory that does not mention evolution. I see a lot of something like 'ID Theory proposes that some stuff is too complicated for evolution to have produced'.

There is no real ID theory. They only have bad critisime on evolution.

 

[Bodhi Dharma Zen]

As I see it, ID is a reaction to Darwin's ideas, basically propelled by Christians. If a "design" imply a "designer". A "designer" imply some sort of decision making, so, suddenly, a personal god appears behind life!

Now, if they were talking about some "inherent force of the universe", that somehow works towards complexity, but using otherwise normal evolutionary concepts, I think most of us will not have a big problem with it.

For me, for example, life is a natural consequence of the universe. I believe that it tends towards complexity "by itself", without no one taking decisions on where does everything goes.

Finding life on other planets, IMO, will confirm that life is as natural as complex atoms, no an impossible result of random events (that require an explanation, according to them).

 

[Psi Baba]

For me, for example, life is a natural consequence of the universe. I believe that it tends towards complexity "by itself", without no one taking decisions on where does everything goes.

Indeed, there is a school of thought which says that life is not something that has only a very miniscule chance of occuring if all the conditions are just right, but in fact is almost inevitable, not unlike the formation of stars and planets. It is, as you say, "a natural consequence of the universe," and once it takes hold it becomes viral and unstoppable. Aside from the fact that we have no evidence or examples of supernatural creators, ID at its simplest definition is still founded on the false premise that life on earth is somehow perfectly arranged and carefully crafted such that a designer is implied. For me, it's just as easy to see life as haphazardly developed, imperfect--jerry-rigged--which goes a long way toward pointing to life forming though blind natural processes rather than having been designed.

Were life to be confirmed as existing on other another planet, this, to me, would be further evidence of life being the result of natural processes. But as others have mentioned, believers in deities would have no problem with it as they would simply say it's all part of God's creation, part of his "plan."