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Largest Prime Number Discovered

Crossbow

Seeking Honesty and Sanity
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Just in case anyone is curious, the largest known Prime Number is now:

257,885,161 - 1

http://news.yahoo.com/largest-prime-number-discovered-165757465.html;_ylt=A2KJ3CZGXBJRjzUAsFvQtDMD

Largest Prime Number Discovered

The largest prime number yet has been discovered — and it's 17,425,170 digits long. The new prime number crushes the last one discovered in 2008, which was a paltry 12,978,189 digits long.

The number — 2 raised to the 57,885,161 power minus 1 — was discovered by University of Central Missouri mathematician Curtis Cooper as part of a giant network of volunteer computers devoted to finding primes, similar to projects like SETI@Home, which downloads and analyzes radio telescope data in the Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (SETI). The network, called the Great Internet Mersenne Prime Search (GIMPS) harnesses about 360,000 processors operating at 150 trillion calculations per second. This is the third prime number discovered by Cooper.

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That's cool.

But does it mean anything useful?

I don't suppose there's any practical application for prime numbers per se?
 
But does it mean anything useful?
For this particular number, probably not.
I don't suppose there's any practical application for prime numbers per se?
Very much there is. They are a basis of modern cryptography. People who want to keep secrets -- or to break into other people's secrets, -- pay a lot of money to number theorists on their staff.
 
That's cool.

But does it mean anything useful?

I don't suppose there's any practical application for prime numbers per se?

Certain fields of cryptography use large primes (although not this large as this prime).

e.g. The most basic form of plain RSA encryption uses prime numbers

Generate two primes p, q where both are around 1024 (or 2048 etc) bits

Set N = pq

Choose 2 integers e,d such that e * d = 1 mod phi(N). So e and d are relatively prime to phi(N)

Your public key is pk = (N, e)
Your private key is sk = (N, d)

To encrypt m

c = m^e mod N

To decrypt c

m = c^d mod N

You shouldn't use that as an encryption scheme on it's own, it isn't secure.

But RSA is used as part of a larger construction to provide a secure crypto scheme.
 
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Missing headline: Largest yet perfect number discovered

Just in case anyone is curious, the largest known Prime Number is now:

257,885,161 - 1

http://news.yahoo.com/largest-prime-number-discovered-165757465.html;_ylt=A2KJ3CZGXBJRjzUAsFvQtDMD

The article mentions this prime number is a so-called Mersenne prime, a prime of the form 2p - 1. It is easy to see that the exponent p then also must be prime. But furthermore, it means that the number
(257,885,161 - 1) * 257,885,160is a so-called perfect number, i.e., a number that equals the sum of its divisors. All even perfect numbers are of this form, and no odd perfect numbers are known.

(and no, I don't know of any practical use of perfect numbers)
 
Certain fields of cryptography use large primes (although not this large as this prime).

(Recipe snipped)

You shouldn't use that as an encryption scheme on it's own, it isn't secure.

But RSA is used as part of a larger construction to provide a secure crypto scheme.

Why isn't it secure on its own?
 
Why isn't it secure on its own?

It isn't secure against chosen ciphertext attacks (CCA-IND). If an scheme is CCA-IND then an attacker shouldn't be able to differentiate between the encryption of 2 messages of the same length with probability greater than negligible.

so e.g, say we have an adversary and challenger (challenger is our proposed CCA-IND scheme) we could do the following:

1) The challenger generates his key.
2) The adversary sends 2 messages to the challenger, lets call them m0 and m1 where |m0| = |m1|
3) The challenger 'flips a coin' heads he encrypts m0. Tails he encrypts m1
3) The challenger sends
cca1.gif
. So in game 0 he receives the encryption of m0 and in game 1 he receives the encryption of m1. The adversary doesn't know what game he is in.

The adversary can do this n times.

4) Adversary then does his chosen ciphertext query. That is he can choose a ciphertext and have it decrypted. So he chooses ci. The only rule here is that c_i can't be any of the ciphertexts already submitted. It has to be a new ciphertext.
5) Adversary receives the decryption of c_i
6) Adversary has to output whether he is in game 0 or game 1.

The adversary shouldn't be able to distinguish between game 0 and game 1 with anything higher than negligible probability. Therefore an encryption scheme is CCA secure if for all efficient adversaries the probability of distinguishing between any two pairs of encrypted messages is negligible. (Efficient just means he can't have unlimited computing power)

So how is plain RSA insecure against this ? Because RSA is multiplicatively homomorphic* That is a multiplication operation on the ciphertext performs multiplication on the plaintext (modulo)

Using small numbers (the math is the same)

Let
p = 11
q = 13

N = 143 (p * q)

phiN_1.gif

where phi(N) = (p-1)(q-1)

We select a value for e (our encryption exponent). e has to be relatiely prime with phi.

e = 17

Our decryption exponent is d = 113 (Read the RSA wiki if you care how e & d are calculated / chosen)

Let's choose a message to encrypt,

m1 = 123

Encrypting m we do c1 = m1e mod N

So, c1 = 12317 mod 143 giving a ciphertext of c1 = 106

This will be one of the message pairs the adversary chooses in the first steps of the CCA game.

Now say the attacker modifies the ciphertext by multiplying it by some value r mod N where r is chosen such that we can find a modular inverse of r mod N.

Let's choose r = 6
and r-1 = 24 as 6*24 mod 143 = 1

Now,

c' = (c1 * (re mod N)) mod N
c1' = (106 * (617 mod 143)) mod 143
c1' = 56

The attacker gets this decrypted by the challenger (remembered allowed in the second step of the CCA game).

The attacker receives back the decryption of 56 (let's call it m1')

m1' = c1' 113 mod 143
m1' = 23

Now because RSA is multiplicatively homomorphic, multiplying the cipher text multiplies the plain text, so:

m = (m' * (r-1 mod N) mod N)

Subbing in our values:

m1 = (23 * (24 mod 143) mod 143)
m1 = 123

The adversary can easily distinguish between game 0 and game 1. He just decrypted the ciphertext he received and checks if that was m0 or m1.

So plain RSA isn't secure against Chosen Cipher text Attacks.

RSA is used with a scheme such as OAEP

But it's worse than that, plain RSA isn't randomised. It's entirely deterministic, therefore it can't even be semantically secure. Semantic security is kind of like the same game above except you skip the phase where you submit a ciphertext to be decrypted. (Semantic security provides security against eavesdropping, chosen ciphertext security and beyond is security against active attackers)

* Homomorphic Encryption is very cool, just not feasible yet. You can read about it here and here. A Fully Homomorphic Scheme would allow operations to be performed on the ciphertext given encrypted results. Think being able to do cloud computing without the machine doing the operations knowing anything about the data or the result!


ETA: How on earth do you do latex on this forum other than creating a gif on the latext site and uploading it to my web server and linking to it as an image ?
 
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Primes have very direct application in music theory -- tuning theory. But anything much over 23, you're probably kidding yourself. Each small prime has a characteristic sound.

Primes of all sizes also can be used to make special self-similar sequences, but again, only the smaller ones are certain to be useful in music theory.

And -- here I'm really getting out of my territory -- they can be used in experimental designs.

Costas sequences, generated from primes, are used to make optimal radar signals.
 
Primes have very direct application in music theory -- tuning theory. But anything much over 23, you're probably kidding yourself.

The number is much higher in cryptography, but there's probably a limit to the size of a number before it becomes impractical.
 
There's a theory that cicadas use prime numbers to protect themselves from fungi, but I understand that theory is in dispute.
 
Primes have very direct application in music theory -- tuning theory. But anything much over 23, you're probably kidding yourself. Each small prime has a characteristic sound.

I don't know anything about music, but is this a technical thing rather than an application where primes can be used to create sounds that sound 'good' ?
 
LandR, you said:
"The attacker gets this decrypted by the challenger (remembered allowed in the second step of the CCA game)."

Is this something that happens in the real world? What I'm asking is that when you said RSA wasn't secure on its own, did you mean "theoretically insecure" (and excellent explanation by the way) as in "a property of this scheme over another scheme" or did you mean "not secure as used in applications?"

It seems to me, I'd avoid playing the game as you outlined it, never offering the feedback required.
 
LandR, you said:
"The attacker gets this decrypted by the challenger (remembered allowed in the second step of the CCA game)."

Is this something that happens in the real world? What I'm asking is that when you said RSA wasn't secure on its own, did you mean "theoretically insecure" (and excellent explanation by the way) as in "a property of this scheme over another scheme" or did you mean "not secure as used in applications?"

It seems to me, I'd avoid playing the game as you outlined it, never offering the feedback required.

Yes, sorry. I guess it's theoretically insecure rather than practically insecure.

I don't know of any scenario where an attacker could get certain ciphertexts decrypted or even where that game would play out in RL but cryptographers seem to be a very paranoid bunch and even theoretical breaks are seen as a big problem.

No cryptographer would suggest using plain RSA. I've seen some crypto guys talk of a scheme being broken if a new attack surfaces which has a run time (or amount of work needing to be done to break the scheme) less than a brute force attack (e.g. cycle the key space) even if the new attack still isn't feasible in the real world. (requires thousands of years running time rather than millenia).

I think that's a good thing though.
 
I don't know anything about music, but is this a technical thing rather than an application where primes can be used to create sounds that sound 'good' ?

If someone wants the sound of the harmonic series* as a systemic part of their music -- built into the tuning -- they need primes 7,11,13 at least, maybe even 17 and 19.

It can sound good in the right hands.

We humans seem to like sounds based on the harmonic series...

(Hard to give a short answer, but the harmonic series is pretty visceral, very hearable.)




*heard in jaw-harps, brass instruments, Tuvan throat singing, synthesizer filter-sweeps, etc.
 
No cryptographer would suggest using plain RSA. I've seen some crypto guys talk of a scheme being broken if a new attack surfaces which has a run time (or amount of work needing to be done to break the scheme) less than a brute force attack (e.g. cycle the key space) even if the new attack still isn't feasible in the real world. (requires thousands of years running time rather than millenia).

I'm less than an amateur on this subject, but my understanding was that the real downside was that RSA alone was too unwieldy and in practice you use another algorithm for the bulk of the work, saving RSA for sending the "necessaries" for that, maybe a random number seed or something.

I've always thought of encryption as a necessary evil reigned in by how bad I need to keep a secret. Kind of like real world locks in that way. Spend more for a better lock only when what you are protecting is worth the cost.

Speaking of which, the encryption used in automobile key fob-style locks is pretty cool and a great example of how applications influence the scheme you pick.
 
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