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Just Another Magic Trick?

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Reading through this thread, I'm struck by the idea that "months of negotiations" to work out a proper protocol is some tactic by JREF to put off potential testees.

I'm a biologist. When I submit a research article (a paper describing some recent, novel, and hopefully important research I've carried out) to a journal for publication, it is farmed out for outside review by several other researchers. They then comment on its quality and recommend to the publication's editor that is be accepted, rejected, or sent back for additional experiments to test things I may have missed, but which they think are important. The third result is the most common.

This entire "negotiation" can takes months and months, at the end of which I will send the revised research in again, and the editor can review it and see if I've done the correct additional work to meet the bar set by those reviewers.

I am, nonetheless, not "put off" by this effort, or the time spent. After all, I've achieved my results in controlled testing in my own research environment, and I am confident of them, and of their importance and their need to be communicated to the rest of the world. If my peers say they want a few more tests, I'm okay with spending the time to do those tests and resubmit the research.

...and that's for a research paper where there's a good chance I'll be paying a thousand bucks in publication fees because academic journals have tight margins. If I were standing to pick up a flat million dollars, I'd be happy to spend years negotiating a proper protocol (although I'd hope, as a scientist, to be able to come up with one much, much faster than that). I mean, unless you're already independently wealthy, how does a million stack up against your annual salary? Surely it's worth the time spent on sporadic emails and forum posts for a couple months leading up to the test.
 
Reading through this thread, I'm struck by the idea that "months of negotiations" to work out a proper protocol is some tactic by JREF to put off potential testees.
This is not a serious reason, merely the bleating of bleevers who want to slag of Randi and any non-bleevers. The pattern is quite obvious.
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This entire "negotiation" can takes months and months, at the end of which I will send the revised research in again, and the editor can review it and see if I've done the correct additional work to meet the bar set by those reviewers.
Now you come to the crux of it.

You and your peers, spend months on a protocol/paper. Most applicants are not JREF member peers. I'm not accusing anyone of wilful ignorance here either, many applicants know nothing of double-blind protocols (most think it means wearing two blindfold) or probability, so immediately become overwhelmed by the process. For the detractors, this is seen as JREF beating up on the Challenge applicants, because more often that not the ARE wilfully ignorant if it allows them to baselessly criticise non-bleevers.
<snip>Surely it's worth the time spent on sporadic emails and forum posts for a couple months leading up to the test.
You'd think so wouldn't you. An most of your peers here would to.;)
 
No, they all want to be tested, they just want to be tested under conditions that even a five year old could pass without knowing what their ability is meant to be. *snip*
My take is that they generally would be happy to demonstrate their "abilities", just as they have presumably done to their friends and relatives, as a sort of performance, rather than test their "abilities".

The difference between a performance and a test is what trips them up.
 
Surely it's worth the time spent on sporadic emails and forum posts for a couple months leading up to the test.

Right. Plus, it wouldn't take so long if applicants would read the rules and figure out just what exactly it is they can do before engaging in MDC discussions.
 
Right. Plus, it wouldn't take so long if applicants would read the rules and figure out just what exactly it is they can do before engaging in MDC discussions.

This seems to be the main problem, actually defining what a person can do. See this thread for an example. People just waffle and stray off topic and talk about how they can 'create energy' and how they want to "show you the matrix" (as one example did) without explaining exacly how they can demonstrate it. They know they can do something special, they just don't know what, or how to show it to others.

The example above is good. The applicant claimed they could make their hand feel so light that it could float off the table, but it doesn't because gravity pulls it back down :boggled:
 
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