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Improving political messaging

Minoosh

Penultimate Amazing
Minoosh
Joined
Jul 15, 2011
Messages
12,761
This came up because I just read something about the GOP accusing Democrats of radical proposals on health care. Obviously it's thought single-payer UHC is a radical concept, but IMO it's really not - per the norms of most (all?) other developed nations. And famously, the ACA was actually a conservative plan, but Republicans still viciously attacked it.

It's true single-payer would be disruptive in the shortish terms, that proposals to abolish private insurance particularly may be seen as threats to people with traditional job-based health insurance and that OK, maybe it is a bit radical compared with the entrenched status quo. (Not a bad thing IMO). But what is the positive messaging that could counteract some people's fears of the dreaded "socialized medicine" and bogus "death panels?"

That's just one example. There are many other areas where Democrats and probably even Republicans have failed to deliver their messages in a way that mobilize popular support. I'm curious if people here have ideas for improving that. Otherwise our politics have largely become tribal bickering over personalities which doesn't do much for productive discourse.
 
Unfortunately, it's the messenger, not the message.
A large majority of Americans fully support the policies of Warren, Sanders etc. as long as they don't know they come from a Democrat.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
That's all part of messaging/marketing.
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what good is a carefully crafted message, when the other side can just straight out lie about what you have said?

The last week has shown that claims about what AOC, IAO, AP and RT have said will dominate any actual discussion of their criticisms.

I don't think candidates can effectively message to anyone trapped in the right-wing media bubble, no matter how clever the wording.
Any effect will be temporary.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
what good is a carefully crafted message, when the other side can just straight out lie about what you have said?

The last week has shown that claims about what AOC, IAO, AP and RT have said will dominate any actual discussion of their criticisms.

I don't think candidates can effectively message to anyone trapped in the right-wing media bubble, no matter how clever the wording.
Any effect will be temporary.
Click to expand...
One: at least this way you have something to counter personal attacks with. Two: It might mobilize young and independent voters not in the right-wing bubble. Three: There's a chance people in the right-wing bubble could be reached - not in great numbers, surely, but enough to understand there's a plan and a strategy, not just mindless bashing of Trump supporters.
 
The newest version of Medicare for All is far beefed up from the 2017 proposal, and I think this hasn't been communicated to the public very well.

We can talk about almost all other industrialized countries in the world having some form of universal healthcare coverage, but M4A 2.0 is prepared to cover above and beyond what many single-payer systems would, far more generous than Canada, the UK, or Australia.

I like Sanders I don't think most of his proposals are radical in the least but on healthcare he's more radical than ever.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
Unfortunately, it's the messenger, not the message.
A large majority of Americans fully support the policies of Warren, Sanders etc. as long as they don't know they come from a Democrat.
Click to expand...
Then ... find trusted figures, not career Democrats, that will spread the message in a nonpartisan way.

I don't know how to do that, but I doubt if it's impossible.
 
Venom said:
The newest version of Medicare for All is far beefed up from the 2017 proposal, and I think this hasn't been communicated to the public very well.
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I think you're probably right - how then to communicate it? Maybe not through Bernie Sanders, but some other channel.
 
Minoosh said:
Then ... find trusted figures, not career Democrats, that will spread the message in a nonpartisan way.

I don't know how to do that, but I doubt if it's impossible.
Click to expand...

I think it's impossible, currently.
If even Mueller can be successfully labelled as a partisan hack, what chance does anyone with a (D) behind the name have!
 
The Great Zaganza said:
I think it's impossible, currently.
If even Mueller can be successfully labelled as a partisan hack, what chance does anyone with a (D) behind the name have!
Click to expand...

I tend to agree it's impossible. Consider that according to right wing media:

Public Schools: Liberal Hotbed
Hollywood: Same
Mainstream Media: Ditto

The primary hurdle, in my opinion: Whatever medium you choose to use to spread the message will immediately be labeled as liberal propaganda.....

.....unless you can find a medium to present the message in such a subtle way that it sneaks past notice of the right wing media machine.
 
The other thing is that Democratic Party policies tend to be somewhat complicated but in order to catch the public imagination, they need to be readily summarised into a three, four or five word catch phrase.

It's been done in the past "The New Deal" so there is some expectation that it can be done again.
 
Than what the hell should Democrats be doing?

There are more Democrats than Republicans and more Independents than either. The messaging could target Democrats/Independents without too much concern about reaching Trump voters. Medicare for all is a pretty simple message; what others can be pressed into service?

It seems to me like the last few posters are just saying, don't bother, Democrats are going to lose.

Getting out the young/minority vote is something they could be doing. Organized voter registration/ID drives, plans for rides to the polls. Is that useless too?

A week or so before the 2016 election Republicans were running help-wanted ads for people to go door-to-door to targeted (I think) voters. Probably a lot of people just don't know where their polling place is. Dems weren't doing that as far as I could tell. I live in a red state that could easily go purple or blue, but probably not if Dems just play dead.
 
For the past few years, I've been thinking that democrats really need to start being brutally honest about the policies they're up against and calling the Republicans out more. There's a reason they have such a reputation for being spineless - the establishment side of the party really does try to cling to respectability politics and try as much as possible to look like the civil, principled ones. It's also why Pelosi keeps attacking AOC and others like her. But that doesn't work when your opposition doesn't hold themselves to the same standard. Fewer people are going to be willing to listen to your calm list of points about causes of problems and how to fix them when Republicans will just blame everything on immigrants and regulations, and say they can fix everything by getting rid of both, while also cutting your taxes. Or cue appeal to the fear of a large evangelical base by portraying you as a bunch of baby murderers. It doesn't matter if most of the country agrees with things like universal healthcare and better environmental policies when you try to sound intellectual and can easily get shouted down by some fear-monger who insists it's impossible to pay for any of that, and that implementing such policies would destroy the country.

The only way to get people to listen is to attack Republicans for how corrupt they are, and for how draconian their policies are. Republicans are screwing over a large portions of their voting base, and Democrats need to start making people realize that they're personally being harmed by the people they vote for. The public message should become "these people are taking millions of dollars of lobbying money to keep you from getting healthcare, their economic policies are making them richer at your expense, climate change will destroy the economy if you let corporations keep destroying the environment, they're using gerrymandering and voter suppression to rig the system and keep themselves rich and keep you from having a voice, they're using certain media sources to lie and misinform you." And it should be specific, it should be pointed out by Democrats that Mitch McConnell's wife was basically funneling tens of millions of dollars to him, that Donald Trump is using the presidency to make himself rich, etc. People that are gaming the system and getting up the shady crap need to be called out and discredited as publicly as possible. Democrats need to make the stakes real again, and start reasserting themselves as the party of the workers. Republicans are scared to play fair, and democrats need to stop letting them get away with it. I know lots of people are terrified of backlash and the right-wing media hate machine, but I honestly think there's be less to worry about if people knew that information was coming from seriously corrupt sources. That's why I have so much respect for the newer progressives like AOC and Omar, they're being honest, and I'm glad that it seems to be working to motivate at least some younger people and independents.
 
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ArchSas said:
For the past few years, I've been thinking that democrats really need to start being brutally honest about the policies they're up against and calling the Republicans out more. There's a reason they have such a reputation for being spineless - the establishment side of the party really does try to cling to respectability politics and try as much as possible to look like the civil, principled ones. It's also why Pelosi keeps attacking AOC and others like her. But that doesn't work when your opposition doesn't hold themselves to the same standard. Fewer people are going to be willing to listen to your calm list of points about causes of problems and how to fix them when Republicans will just blame everything on immigrants and regulations, and say they can fix everything by getting rid of both, while also cutting your taxes. Or cue appeal to the fear of a large evangelical base by portraying you as a bunch of baby murderers. It doesn't matter if most of the country agrees with things like universal healthcare and better environmental policies when you try to sound intellectual and can easily get shouted down by some fear-monger who insists it's impossible to pay for any of that, and that implementing such policies would destroy the country.

The only way to get people to listen is to attack Republicans for how corrupt they are, and for how draconian their policies are. Republicans are screwing over a large portions of their voting base, and Democrats need to start making people realize that they're personally being harmed by the people they vote for. The public message should become "these people are taking millions of dollars of lobbying money to keep you from getting healthcare, their economic policies are making them richer at your expense, climate change will destroy the economy if you let corporations keep destroying the environment, they're using gerrymandering and voter suppression to rig the system and keep themselves rich and keep you from having a voice, they're using certain media sources to lie and misinform you." And it should be specific, it should be pointed out by Democrats that Mitch McConnell's wife was basically funneling tens of millions of dollars to him, that Donald Trump is using the presidency to make himself rich, etc. People that are gaming the system and getting up the shady crap need to be called out and discredited as publicly as possible. Democrats need to make the stakes real again, and start reasserting themselves as the party of the workers. Republicans are scared to play fair, and democrats need to stop letting them get away with it. I know lots of people are terrified of backlash and the right-wing media hate machine, but I honestly think there's be less to worry about if people knew that information was coming from seriously corrupt sources. That's why I have so much respect for the newer progressives like AOC and Omar, they're being honest, and I'm glad that it seems to be working to motivate at least some younger people and independents.
Click to expand...


That has been the modus operandi for two years and it isn't working.
 
The Great Zaganza said:
what good is a carefully crafted message, when the other side can just straight out lie about what you have said?

The last week has shown that claims about what AOC, IAO, AP and RT have said will dominate any actual discussion of their criticisms.

I don't think candidates can effectively message to anyone trapped in the right-wing media bubble, no matter how clever the wording.
Any effect will be temporary.
Click to expand...

You have to shout louder and more often.
 
Venom said:
The newest version of Medicare for All is far beefed up from the 2017 proposal, and I think this hasn't been communicated to the public very well.

We can talk about almost all other industrialized countries in the world having some form of universal healthcare coverage, but M4A 2.0 is prepared to cover above and beyond what many single-payer systems would, far more generous than Canada, the UK, or Australia.

I like Sanders I don't think most of his proposals are radical in the least but on healthcare he's more radical than ever.
Click to expand...

He comes across as radical when he shouts free ponies* for everyone and doesn't communicate a realistic plan to pay for it.

That leaves the door open for the GOP to shout, they are going to tax you to death.

The voting public can relate to too much tax. When they think about free college they get the image of a freeloader.

Sanders is fooled by the crowds he shouts at cheering for him. He's in denial about how his message sounds to everyone else. He doesn't know how to frame his message.


*Free ponies is a metaphor.
 
Minoosh said:
Than what the hell should Democrats be doing?
Click to expand...
Hiring a professional marketing company. Clear the 'we've always done it this way' cobwebs out of the DNC.

Minoosh said:
It seems to me like the last few posters are just saying, don't bother, Democrats are going to lose.
Click to expand...
They are and they might as well be saying 'I give up' whine whine whine.

Minoosh said:
Getting out the young/minority vote is something they could be doing. Organized voter registration/ID drives, plans for rides to the polls. Is that useless too?

A week or so before the 2016 election Republicans were running help-wanted ads for people to go door-to-door to targeted (I think) voters. Probably a lot of people just don't know where their polling place is. Dems weren't doing that as far as I could tell. I live in a red state that could easily go purple or blue, but probably not if Dems just play dead.
Click to expand...
:thumbsup:
 
You can't cure stupid.

Institute Medicare For All Who Want It. The rest will happily bankrupt themselves and die of preventable diseases.
 
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