How Does JE Receive Messages?

[Garrette]

This was originally posted in another thread by Instig8r:

He also knew that someone had a double name ("Yan-Yan", the chef - whose picture appears online).

I'm interested to hear how JE gets the idea of a double name.
I would think it's not clairaudiently; I don't see how it could be clairvoyantly. What image would he get? What sound would he hear?

I'll be up front and say that I believe it to be another inconsistency that some will attempt to explain away in their defense of JE.

He hears messages, but sometimes only an initial.

He sees things that convey an impression.

He feels sensations in different parts of his body.

But how, really, would he get the idea that someone had a double name?

 

[Instig8R]

Hi, Garrette-- I posted an answer to your query on the other thread, but I'll re-post it here:

"That is a good point you made. The chef's name is Ignazio Leone, but his nickname is Yan-Yan. I don't recall how JE claims to have gotten the "double-name" information. I do know that according to neo, JE usually gets names clairaudiently."

(Maybe I'll go back and delete the other post, before things get too confusing! )

 

[De_Bunk]

JE doesnt hear voices...

Only insane, delusional people hear voices...

JE is a liar...and cannot prove, legally or scientifically, that he actually hears voices...

Whereas it can be proved that insane, delusional people, truly believe they hear voices...


You decide...

DB

You know where my thoughts lay...

 

[BillHoyt]

This was originally posted in another thread by Instig8r:



I'm interested to hear how JE gets the idea of a double name.
I would think it's not clairaudiently; I don't see how it could be clairvoyantly. What image would he get? What sound would he hear?

I'll be up front and say that I believe it to be another inconsistency that some will attempt to explain away in their defense of JE.

He hears messages, but sometimes only an initial.

He sees things that convey an impression.

He feels sensations in different parts of his body.

But how, really, would he get the idea that someone had a double name?

You're in for a treat here! Wait till you hear the answers! I'd also add to your list the "spice names" guess from the LKL transcripts. Finally, the "map/place names" guess from the LKL transcripts.

The specific spice names were: "salty", "pepper" and "cinnamon". Sound alike? Look alike? Taste alike? No, no and no.

Cheers,

 

[CFLarsen]

JE: "They are showing me a spice name...salty...pepper...cinnamon...curry...chili..."

Sitter: "My sister's uncle's cousin's granddad's neighbor came from Chile!"

(applause in the studio)

(JE-fans get a collective orgasm)

 

[Clancie]

Posted by Instig8r

I don't recall how JE claims to have gotten the "double-name" information. I do know that according to neo, JE usually gets names clairaudiently

Hi g8r. That's usually true, but not always the case. Sometimes he sees an image that leads him to a name (like the LKL reading with a "spice name"). Or seeing the Mayflower moving van. Or like yesterday, seeing Lily Tomlin doing the Ernestine routine and trying to figure out if the image was about being a phone operator, the name Ernestine, or the name Lily. (It was Lily). Now you all see that as just "widening the net", but I think there are easier ways to do that.

Re: Yan Yan. He didn't say how he got the double name, just that he was getting the sense of a double name. Knowing the way he works, this would make one think it was not being given to him clairaudiently, but clairvoyantly.

Most likely he was being shown a friend or relative with a double name, perhaps he even has one particular person that symbolizes that to him, like someone seeing Uncle JoJo and recognizing that has become his symbol for a double name.

Not expecting to convince anyone here that's what he was doing. Just answering the hypothetical of "how could he do it and be consistent with the 'process'". This is how.

 

[CFLarsen]

Just answering the hypothetical of "how could he do it and be consistent with the 'process'". This is how.

The question is not hypothetical at all. Your answer is, though. It is also a blueprint for cold reading.

So far, nobody has given any explanation that was not consistent with cold reading. And yet, it doesn't sink in....

Amazing. Simply amazing.

 

[BillHoyt]

Not expecting to convince anyone here that's what he was doing. Just answering the hypothetical of "how could he do it and be consistent with the 'process'". This is how.

You describe no "process" here at all. You simply describe some post-hoc apologetics. There is little here with logic to it.

Clairaudient? Yes, unless it isn't in which case it is clairvoyant. When it isn't that, it is clairsomethingelse.

Is that clair?

 

[CFLarsen]

You describe no "process" here at all. You simply describe some post-hoc apologetics. There is little here with logic to it.

Clairaudient? Yes, unless it isn't in which case it is clairvoyant. When it isn't that, it is clairsomethingelse.

Is that clair?

Absolutely.

If a "process" has any value, we need to be able to determine beforehand what will happen. As it is, what Clancie and neofight are describing is, as you said, post-hoc apologetics.

 

[voidx]

Another thing to remember is that regardless of which form of Clairaudience/voyance/sentience he uses. He always ends up fishing for information, or starting off general, and then broadening until he hits on something more specific. Just like a cold reader. How he originally receives the information in his head to me seems less important as all 3 look to me like cold-reading when he tries to relate them to the sitter.

Edited to add: The improtance of this is, who knows what goes on in his head, no one can measure this, or verify it one way or the other, its complete hearsay and conjecture. However, how he relays this information to the sitter is visible, we can see it and analyze it, and from all I've seen, it looks like cold-reading.

 

[dingler44]

JE: "They are showing me a spice name...salty...pepper...cinnamon...curry...chili..."

Sitter: "My sister's uncle's cousin's granddad's neighbor came from Chile!"

(applause in the studio)

(JE-fans get a collective orgasm)

HAHAHA!

One of your better attempts at humor, Claus! (at least according to my tastes)

 

[BNiles]

Clancie,

I was going to lay into you regarding your "enabler" post, but then I saw that everyone else had already done it. That takes all the fun out of a good argument.

Instead, I'll just point out the Varanormal experience of ClairAudience. This is where the deceiver uses their audience as cannon fodder. You come up with wonderful explanations for his process; and those that take the least heat, he repeats in his own words. There after, others repeat it until it becomes fact.

In politics it's called "Floating A Trial Balloon".

 

[CFLarsen]

You come up with wonderful explanations for his process; and those that take the least heat, he repeats in his own words. There after, others repeat it until it becomes fact.

Which is why it is imperative that we don't let the repetitions go unchallenged.

Never, never, never let the woowoos get the final word.

 

[Ladewig]

While I entertain absolutely no notions that JE hears dead people speaking to him, I will say that getting a feeling for a double name is not necessarily evidence of his not speaking to the dead. When I try to remember a name, I may get only a letter or something along the lines of "double name." If the dead were placing sensations or fleeting thoughts into JE's head, he could receive something like "double name."

On the other hand, I find the the "spicy, salty, peppery" bit very difficult to accept. Especially because a native of Chile would not consider the name of his country to be anything like a spice name. Once again we see the all-dead-people-speak-English routine that is so old that it was starting to stink a hundred years ago.

 

[CFLarsen]

Once again we see the all-dead-people-speak-English routine that is so old that it was starting to stink a hundred years ago.

Oh, yeah.... That's a funny aspect of the whole necromancy routine. Psychic/Medium Brian Hurst claims that his mentor Leslie Flint channeled the Spanish painter Goya and the French entertainer Maurice Chevalier.

Goya was speaking English, although he never learned English in his life. And the soundclip of "Chevalier" sounded nothing like the real Chevalier.

This was - after I pointed this out to Brian Hurst - explained away with the poor quality there sometimes can be in these channelings.

Brian and I are not on the best of terms. He doesn't like probing questions.

 

[Quasi]

I believe he uses the old "vibrations" excuse. So everything vibrates at a frequency and he can tune to it and the spirits can match his vibrational frequency. Only some people are more sensitive to this, which explains psychics.
Despite his saying so, his entire act, and that of other psychics has been, and will always be "reading." That is shotgunning answers, fishing for results, and following up on leads, going from vague to specific. Oldest trick in the book.

 

[BNiles]

That is shotgunning answers, fishing for results, and following up on leads, going from vague to specific. Oldest trick in the book.

I thought the oldest trick in the book was creating light?

 

[Clancie]

Posted by Laedwig

On the other hand, I find the the "spicy, salty, peppery" bit very difficult to accept. Especially because a native of Chile would not consider the name of his country to be anything like a spice name. Once again we see the all-dead-people-speak-English routine that is so old that it was starting to stink a hundred years ago.

Just making sure, Laedwig. You do realize that little "Chile" vignette was just Claus's complete fantasy version of a JE reading, right?

Here's the actual "spice" part of that LKL transcript re: the sitter's dog, living..."Ginger":

CALLER: Good. I'm just seeing if you can connect with anything?

EDWARD: The first thing -- actually, a couple of things. Somebody's got a nickname after a spice, like pepper?

CALLER: I'm sorry?

EDWARD: Somebody has a nickname after a spice, like pepper? Who's got a spice name?

CALLER: Spice name? Don't know.

EDWARD: Salty or pepper, cinnamon.

CALLER: Oh, my dog.

EDWARD: OK. What's the name?

CALLER: Her name is Ginger.

 

[Clancie]

Posted by Bill Niles
Clancie,

I was going to lay into you regarding your "enabler" post, but then I saw that everyone else had already done it. That takes all the fun out of a good argument.

Hi Bill,
You must be new around here! No one ever holds back to a "believer", no matter how many times its already been said! That's a basic debate principle!

Instead, I'll just point out the Varanormal experience of ClairAudience. This is where the deceiver uses their audience as cannon fodder.

You come up with wonderful explanations for his process; and those that take the least heat, he repeats in his own words. There after, others repeat it until it becomes fact.

Could you rephrase this? For some reason, I'm not sure I understand what you mean.

If you think I made up a rationalization for JE, I didn't. I just repeated how he explains his own "process" of getting information (including names) as a mix of clairaudience and clairvoyance.

People here may think he's excelled at coming up with rationalizations for cold reading, but I'm pointing out that whether we agree or not about the "rationalization" part, he is consistent.

 

[CFLarsen]

Annnnnnnnnd............here is the full transcript of that reading:

CALLER: Good. I'm just seeing if you can connect with anything?

EDWARD: The first thing -- actually, a couple of things. Somebody's got a nickname after a spice, like pepper?

CALLER: I'm sorry?

EDWARD: Somebody has a nickname after a spice, like pepper? Who's got a spice name?

CALLER: Spice name? Don't know.

EDWARD: Salty or pepper, cinnamon.

CALLER: Oh, my dog.

EDWARD: OK. What's the name?

CALLER: Her name is Ginger.

EDWARD: Has that dog passed?

CALLER: No.

EDWARD: OK. Then you got that dog after somebody passed. Because they're making me feel like I need to bring up the dog, because they're bringing up the spice name. I'm also going to tell you that -- I think what I'm supposed to tell you is that there is either there's a boyfriend who passed for you, or a husband that's passed for you. But I don't feel it now.

CALLER: No?

EDWARD: Remember what I'm saying, OK? There's a male figure that has passed, but it's not a now thing. I'm not predicting it, it happened already, it would be somebody that would be connected to your side, but there's a love bond that's there.

To me, it's not a brother, it's like -- it doesn't feel like a brother to me. It feels like it's somebody's boyfriend or feels like somebody's husband. But it's like somebody that you were involved with, or somebody who was involved on that level who has passed that I'm getting this connection to. That's what's coming through. Probably not who you want to hear from, I'm sorry.

But the reference does come through, first and foremost, to the spice connection. Sorry.

CALLER: OK. All right.

KING: Thank you.

Strangely enough, Clancie chose not to show us the embarrassing parts:

• The dog wasn't dead.
• JE claims he has to bring up a dog - but the sitter tells him it's a dog.
• JE claims a dead boyfriend or husband - of "somebody". This is never acknowledged.

Most damning of all: There is absolutely no acknowledged contact with anybody who died here! According to Clancie, this means that it wasn't a reading at all. She brushed off Neil's cold reading transcript for this reason (although erroneously), so it is quite amazing that she doesn't brush off this reading, too.

But then, this is a JE reading...so I guess it's OK in Clancie's book...