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God, Evolution and the Clitoris

CriticalSock

Master Poster
CriticalSock
Joined
Apr 4, 2008
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I was having a heated discussion with my christian mother recently, prompted by her snorting in derision at a comment of David Attenboroughs on a nature documentary (I normally avoid the subject), and her crowning argument for creation over evolution was the human clitoris.

The idea being that the clitoris serves no function except to provide pleasure, therefore humans would never have evolved a clitoris and it proves we were created by God.

My arguments faltered after that, mostly because of hearing my mother say the word "clitoris". :)

So my question is, what is the evolutionary explanation for the existence of the clitoris?
 
CriticalSock said:
I was having a heated discussion with my christian mother recently, prompted by her snorting in derision at a comment of David Attenboroughs on a nature documentary (I normally avoid the subject), and her crowning argument for creation over evolution was the human clitoris.

The idea being that the clitoris serves no function except to provide pleasure, therefore humans would never have evolved a clitoris and it proves we were created by God.

My arguments faltered after that, mostly because of hearing my mother say the word "clitoris". :)

So my question is, what is the evolutionary explanation for the existence of the clitoris?
Click to expand...

Am I missing something here? Is your question really 'What reproductive advantage could a creature get from having something that would make the females want to have more sex?'?

Isn't that kind of self-explanatory?
 
Clitoris a gift from God?
That's one of the better pro-faith arguments I've ever heard.
I mean, how many "oh my God, oh my God, oh my god oh my GO-O-O-ODs" we have heard in our (private) lives...
That's got to be it. Makes perfect sense.
 
If anything, I'd think the existence of the clitoris is an argument against a God who punishes you for enjoying sex.
 
Last of the Fraggles said:
Am I missing something here? Is your question really 'What reproductive advantage could a creature get from having something that would make the females want to have more sex?'?

Isn't that kind of self-explanatory?
Click to expand...

I think the underlying idea behind what she's saying is that pleasure isn't necessary to the reproductive process, therefore why would a creature evolve with an unnecessary attribute that just happens to be lots of fun.

The just happens to be lots of fun part is the important bit... :)
 
CriticalSock said:
I think the underlying idea behind what she's saying is that pleasure isn't necessary to the reproductive process, therefore why would a creature evolve with an unnecessary attribute that just happens to be lots of fun.

The just happens to be lots of fun part is the important bit... :)
Click to expand...

It's a trap! Lots of fun, but the resulting problems (18 years of problems, very often) aren't worth it. :D
 
One Tenth said:
Why is eating pleasurable? Therefore, God exists.
Click to expand...

Did you mean to say this? In a thread about the clitoris? What exactly do you mean? :o



I seem to remember that when a female reaches climax, the muscles in the vaginal wall 'wave' backward to the uterus. This has the effect of aiding the little swimmers in reaching the egg, increasing the chances of conceiving. Ergo, no need for any god(s).



I think us blokes still don't know what a clitoris is for!




ETA: Beaten to the joke by Gawdzilla. Damn you, damn you all to hell.
 
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JFrankA said:
I'll agree there, but if I can do something to it that will cause more women want to have more sex, that's all I need to know!!!! :D
Click to expand...


I don't care about more women wanting to have sex, I just want more women to want to have sex with me!
 
Ironically, the clitoris and the penis are homologous structures. They are evidence of evolution. Stephen Jay Gould wrote an essay titled Male Nipples and Clitoral Ripples that deals with this subject. It can be found in the collection Bully For Brontosaurus.
 
CriticalSock said:
I was having a heated discussion with my christian mother recently, prompted by her snorting in derision at a comment of David Attenboroughs on a nature documentary (I normally avoid the subject), and her crowning argument for creation over evolution was the human clitoris.

The idea being that the clitoris serves no function except to provide pleasure, therefore humans would never have evolved a clitoris and it proves we were created by God.

My arguments faltered after that, mostly because of hearing my mother say the word "clitoris". :)

So my question is, what is the evolutionary explanation for the existence of the clitoris?
Click to expand...

She is channeling Yrreg, you need an exorcism. :D
 
JFrankA said:
/end thread :)
Click to expand...

That's what I thought... my little heart sank. :)

Foster Zygote said:
Ironically, the clitoris and the penis are homologous structures. They are evidence of evolution. Stephen Jay Gould wrote an essay titled Male Nipples and Clitoral Ripples that deals with this subject. It can be found in the collection Bully For Brontosaurus.
Click to expand...

But this could be a lot of help too! Thanks!!
 
Foster Zygote said:
Ironically, the clitoris and the penis are homologous structures. They are evidence of evolution. Stephen Jay Gould wrote an essay titled Male Nipples and Clitoral Ripples that deals with this subject. It can be found in the collection Bully For Brontosaurus.
Click to expand...

That's what I was thinking. The bad design of the clitoris has all the earmarks of a gradual change that is suboptimal but basically neutral in imparting survival advantage.

Fortunately, God gave man the intelligence necessary to create the vibrator. (For educational purposes only, of course!)
 
CriticalSock said:
I've had that argument used against me too! i.e. There's no need for food to taste good. The fact it does = god.
Click to expand...

You could maybe try turning it around on them. Not all food tastes good after all. Give them a bite of something they detest and ask them if that is proof of god's existence.

Then ask them if it's more simple to just believe that human beings have a taste preference for sugar. As opposed to an inter-dimensional bearded dude designing some tasty foods and some bad foods for some animals he also created on the one planet he created although in the whole sum of universe (he created) food is such a small part it's nearly non-existent, as are we.

Plus there is a need for food to taste good (to us). That's how we know to eat it. Poison is generally found in the not tasty category and that's one reason we're inclined to avoid it.

But the ultimate truth here is that you're arguing with some hard core believers and probably nothing you do will change their minds.
 
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