Ghost gravity and friction

[Senex]

For some reason when I hear of ghosts I wonder if the ghost in question has mass and if it doesn't how gravity applies to a massless object and how an object without mass can move. I know gravity can bend light but can gravity hold a ghost in place. I know there are posters here who understand the physics ghosts must need to work under.

I have high aspirations for this thread. I'd like it to be a thread that can be pointed to in the future for ghost believers to have to address.

 

[Aepervius]

Magic. Once you start with assumption on consciousness or memory being preserved without body, you can just add one more assumption pulled out of thin air, it won't change anything.

Think of God-works-in-mysterious-way , but for anything supernatural "it is magic and mysterious".

 

[Fnord]

Quantum vibrational dark matter energy emanating telepathically from an alternate reality.

 

[Crossbow]

For some reason when I hear of ghosts I wonder if the ghost in question has mass and if it doesn't how gravity applies to a massless object and how an object without mass can move. I know gravity can bend light but can gravity hold a ghost in place. I know there are posters here who understand the physics ghosts must need to work under.

I have high aspirations for this thread. I'd like it to be a thread that can be pointed to in the future for ghost believers to have to address.

I think that just goes to show how silly the whole ghost thing really is.

For example, ghosts are often seen wearing clothes; and many time, the clothes that they were buried in. Well, if the ghost is really some sort of 'spirit of the person' then why would it be wearing clothes, unless the clothes have some sort spirit as well?

And if clothes do have a spirit, then how to clothes spirts always manage to stay on the human spirits?

Another odd thing is even though ghosts are often seen walking through walls, yet how is that they can push against the ground with their feet in order to walk? After all, if something was immaterial that it could pass through a solid wall, then it should not be able to push against a solid floor either.

Ugh!

Those are just three of the ghost fallacies that I think of right off hand.

 

[AdMan]

Yeah, I think it's premature to start discussing the physics of ghosts, without proof of the existence of ghosts in the first place.

Otherwise you could pretty much make anything up and it would make as much (or as little) sense as anything else.

 

[Lucian]

.....
And if clothes do have a spirit, then how to clothes spirits always manage to stay on the human spirits?
......

I believe you'll find that ectoplasm is very adhesive, although many modern ghosts prefer spirit-velcro.

 

[aggle-rithm]

I think that just goes to show how silly the whole ghost thing really is.

For example, ghosts are often seen wearing clothes; and many time, the clothes that they were buried in. Well, if the ghost is really some sort of 'spirit of the person' then why would it be wearing clothes, unless the clothes have some sort spirit as well?

And if clothes do have a spirit, then how to clothes spirts always manage to stay on the human spirits?

And do the pockets of the spirit clothes have spirit lint in them?

 

[I Ratant]

How does a ghost, which walks -through- walls, manage to walk up stairs, using the steps, if it isn't a solid object, or have the ability to rattle a chain it's picked up?

 

[Ziggurat]

For example, ghosts are often seen wearing clothes; and many time, the clothes that they were buried in. Well, if the ghost is really some sort of 'spirit of the person' then why would it be wearing clothes, unless the clothes have some sort spirit as well?

That's easy: the clothes are part of the ghost's self-conception, and that's what gives both the clothes and the "body" their form.

But of course, in that event the clothes should be either what they died while wearing, or what they commonly wore or liked best or some such, not what they were buried in.

Another odd thing is even though ghosts are often seen walking through walls, yet how is that they can push against the ground with their feet in order to walk?

That one's always bugged the **** out of me.

 

[ben m]

How does a ghost, which walks -through- walls, manage to walk up stairs, using the steps, if it isn't a solid object,

That explains why we never see ghosts on Earth. Lacking solidity but obeying the laws of gravity, they sink through the floorboards and accumulate in the Earth's core. Their fate there depends on whether they're fermions or bosons.

 

[Ziggurat]

That explains why we never see ghosts on Earth. Lacking solidity but obeying the laws of gravity, they sink through the floorboards and accumulate in the Earth's core. Their fate there depends on whether they're fermions or bosons.

Ghosts are distinguishable, so that's not relevant. But the question of whether ectoplasm is fermionic or bosonic could be important, if ghosts get smooshed together hard enough.

 

[LarianLeQuella]

That explains why we never see ghosts on Earth. Lacking solidity but obeying the laws of gravity, they sink through the floorboards and accumulate in the Earth's core. Their fate there depends on whether they're fermions or bosons.

My daughter read a book a while back that used that as a plot device. I forget the name of the book though. Everlost or something like that.

 

[Mark6]

How does a ghost, which walks -through- walls, manage to walk up stairs, using the steps, if it isn't a solid object, or have the ability to rattle a chain it's picked up?

Keeping in mind that ghosts are made-up, I have no problem with this. They can interact with any solid object as long as they want to. If a ghost wants to drop one floor down, it can stop interacting with the floor and will sink. Like Gil Hamilton's psychic arm, which can wipe the dust off a TV set as easily as reach inside and touch the circuitry.

One place where "walks ON floor but THROUGH walls" bugs me to no end is TV shows where characters are somehow shifted out of reality and have no control over what they are doing. I recall a TNG episode like that.

 

[CMacDady]

If a ghost is bound by physics, then interacting with physical objects is fine and I can understand it being able to carry chains or books etc. However, if this is the case then it should have to follow all the rules, not just ones it happens to like. If it can walk on floors and pick up objects, then it certainly could not walk through a wall.

Then if the ghost were not bound by physics and could walk through walls, it would not be able to interact with anything physical. The ghost would only be an apparition, purely visual.

I see no room for a middle ground where a ghost could have some rules of physics applied to it and others ignored, or where a ghost has the ability to switch between having physics applied to it and then not.

 

[I Ratant]

If a ghost is bound by physics, then interacting with physical objects is fine and I can understand it being able to carry chains or books etc. However, if this is the case then it should have to follow all the rules, not just ones it happens to like. If it can walk on floors and pick up objects, then it certainly could not walk through a wall.

Then if the ghost were not bound by physics and could walk through walls, it would not be able to interact with anything physical. The ghost would only be an apparition, purely visual.

I see no room for a middle ground where a ghost could have some rules of physics applied to it and others ignored, or where a ghost has the ability to switch between having physics applied to it and then not.

.
It's like a revealed religion, which relies on accepting some parts of reality and dismissing/ignoring other parts which are inconvenient to the story.

 

[ben m]

If a ghost is bound by physics, then interacting with physical objects is fine and I can understand it being able to carry chains or books etc. However, if this is the case then it should have to follow all the rules, not just ones it happens to like. If it can walk on floors and pick up objects, then it certainly could not walk through a wall.

I don't particularly mind if a ghost that walks on floors but goes through walls. Think of it as a purely-visual phenomenon, that the ghost is free to appear anywhere it wants to in space. If it wants to appear in a place such that its feet appear to be touching the floor, there's no law of non-ghost physics preventing that.

 

[thenigotoffthebus]

Funnily enough I had an exchange on youtube recently about something very similar. I was curious to see how those that believe in such things manage to get round such physical problems. Quite easily as it turned out.....

How much does ones spirit or whatever weigh when astral traveling? I mean does the consciousness/spirit when astral traveling have any mass? Just wondering.

Some have tried to weight the spirit or soul but that's irrelevant because from my perspective, it's truly weightless but yet mightly powerful

I wonder how it manages to keep up with the movement of the earth then. I mean when you think about it we are not static in space. The earth spins at 1000mph, travels round the sun at 67,000mph and the solar system itself is whizzing round the Milky Way at 600,000 mph. In short when you are sitting in a room you are actually moving at almost unimaginable high speed. We just dont notice because of the affects of gravity. But the spirit isnt affected by gravity. Hows it keeping up!

The spirit vibrates at a frequency that's not bound by any of the gravitational laws of this holographic universe and this is why it's so powerful. The spirit is indestructable and boundless. Let's try not to think of these infinite constructs in such a limiting way because that would be like trying to force a large square peg into a small cylinder opening ; the two just won't fit!

Im the type of person who values evidence when a claim is made so your answer sounds like pure nonsense to me. I just think its an interesting thought problem for people who believe in the spirit, ghosts etc. Seems to be these things are often talked about with an assumed fixed reference point to the physical world. eg a ghost in the doorway. But that doorways moving, fast. So the observed ghost has to be too. Maybe it has thrusters. Or maybe its all just in the observers head.

I don't beLIEve in spirits, I know this is such because I have much personal evidence validation and then some through years of experiences beyond the veil but if you don't resonate with what I speak, that's your perrogative. However, I will say that I don't think you will never get your satisfactory 'evidence' from third-parties or the physical world. Your proof will b through shifting your consciousness beyond this 3rd density and physical focus; it's that simple. Be Well.

 

[biomorph]

Quantum vibrational dark matter energy emanating telepathically from an alternate reality.

Obviously, how could I have figured anyhow else?
You gave me a chuckle, smilie for yu,
tnx

 

[Halfcentaur]

Patrick Swayze went through all this this guys. It's all in your subconscious or something. You just have to focus.

 

[biomorph]

Patrick Swayze went through all this this guys. It's all in your subconscious or something. You just have to focus.

that entails finding my glasses.
after 3 glasses of rose, that might be a touch difficult..... (hic!)