Free market as cure for US health care ills

[varwoche]

It has been suggested many times on this forum that a free market will solve certain problems in the US health care / health insurance system, but without much specificity behind the proposals. So here in this thread, I invite the free market proponents to flesh it out.

In your proposed free market...

* Will Medicare exist?
* Will Medicaid exist?
* Will Social Security exist?
* Will drugs still be approved by the FDA?
* Will insurance companies be regulated in any way?
* Will government still regulate who is permitted to be a health care provider?

In short, what are the major differences between the system we have today and the system you envision? If you have an essay to contribute, please include succinct answers to the above questions.

 

[qayak]

It has been suggested many times on this forum that a free market will solve certain problems in the US health care / health insurance system, but without much specificity behind the proposals. So here in this thread, I invite the free market proponents to flesh it out.

In your proposed free market...

* Will Medicare exist?
* Will Medicaid exist?
* Will Social Security exist?
* Will drugs still be approved by the FDA?
* Will insurance companies be regulated in any way?
* Will government still regulate who is permitted to be a health care provider?

In short, what are the major differences between the system we have today and the system you envision? If you have an essay to contribute, please include succinct answers to the above questions.

Ummmm . . . hasn't the freemarket system been tried time and again with medical systems without success? Freemarket are about businesses making money, medical systems are not. They are about providing affordable healthcare to all citizens.

 

[Undesired Walrus]

If anyone thinks the Free Market produces the best results, you only have to direct them towards the film industry and show them what's in the top 10 at the box office.

 

[Rolfe]

I think the people varwoche is aiming this at simply have a faith-based belief in the free market pixies as the solution to all ills. I don't think they have a clue about the specifics.

And the fact that there isn't a single free-market-based system that delivers effective universal healthcare means they don't have an example to point to.

Why is that, do you think?

Rolfe.

 

[Thunder]

the free market assumes that HMOs don't communicate with each other to keep prices high.

if the free market was the solution the health-care costs, prices would be going down to the bear minimum that allows a profit...not going up.

 

[Tatyana]

If anyone thinks the Free Market produces the best results, you only have to direct them towards the film industry and show them what's in the top 10 at the box office.

Jeebus Crackers, James Cameron has the top two grossing films of all time.

Game, set and match.

 

[Alt+F4]

If anyone thinks the Free Market produces the best results, you only have to direct them towards the film industry and show them what's in the top 10 at the box office.

How does best results relate to something subjective such as liking or disliking a movie (that you have already paid for) versus how sucessful a kidney transplant is?

 

[Thunder]

the free market might be great for health-care prices, but the USA is far from being a free market system. we haven't been one for decades.

oh well

 

[kellyb]

the free market might be great for health-care prices, but the USA is far from being a free market system. we haven't been one for decades.

oh well

That's kind of the point of this thread. How, exactly, would the free market be great for overall US health care prices?

 

[xjx388]

Ummmm . . . hasn't the freemarket system been tried time and again with medical systems without success? Freemarket are about businesses making money, medical systems are not. They are about providing affordable healthcare to all citizens.

Can you point to a free market system being tried "time and again" in recent memory? The fact is that there has not been a free market in US Healthcare in quite some time.

Why is it not OK for "medical systems" to make profits?

 

[kellyb]

Why is it not OK for "medical systems" to make profits?

Well, the most profitable one in the developed world, ours, works the worst for "the people".

That said, with the right type of government interventions, they can work and be fairly profitable to a few players, too. Even the NHS does profit people. It's not like all the NHS workers are working out of pure charity. Drugs are paid for to pharma companies.

It's leaving the limits of the profits to the free market that gets you (if "you" are a consumer) in trouble.

 

[Virus]

If anyone thinks the Free Market produces the best results, you only have to direct them towards the film industry and show them what's in the top 10 at the box office.

That's a pretty ridiculous example as there is no state film industry.

 

[BobTheDonkey]

That's a pretty ridiculous example as there is no state film industry.

I think that's rather the point...

 

[Wildy]

If anyone thinks the Free Market produces the best results, you only have to direct them towards the film industry and show them what's in the top 10 at the box office.

Wouldn't that depend on what your definition of "best result" is?

If you consider the "best result" to be "make ********* of money" then clearly the film industry has produced the best results.

 

[Delvo]

It doesn't really matter what a free market would do, because it will never be allowed to exist. The only possibilities to choose between are a socialized, government-run system, and one consisting of a mash of private businesses, government agencies, private professional organizations, and a patchwork of government regulations stapled into the pile from various angles.

 

[qayak]

Can you point to a free market system being tried "time and again" in recent memory? The fact is that there has not been a free market in US Healthcare in quite some time.

Yes, and when it ws there, it didn't work.

Why is it not OK for "medical systems" to make profits?

For the same reason it isn't okay for the road system to make money or a public school system to make profits. It gets to the point very quickly where only a small percentage of the population can afford them.

 

[kellyb]

For the same reason it isn't okay for the road system to make money or a public school system to make profits. It gets to the point very quickly where only a small percentage of the population can afford them.

Individual workers and managers make a profit/money, though. Having gov in charge just caps upper management profits, in essence.

 

[Undesired Walrus]

How does best results relate to something subjective such as liking or disliking a movie (that you have already paid for) versus how sucessful a kidney transplant is?

Because a film like Avatar can convince you to see it based on an incredibly expensive marketing campaign that programmes everyone into believing that you must see this. None of this means the film will be good, it just means the studio (Insurance company) is good at pulling the wool over your eyes.

 

[rustypouch]

The thing about for-profit healthcare is that it doesn't follow traditional supply/demand dynamics.

It's not like most consumer goods, where demand decreases as price rises. The demand is almost static, if not increasing as the population ages.

No matter the price of healthcare, people will pay it, because they want to live. I can't imagine a price point that would make parents stop cancer treatments for a sick child, as an example.

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

The thing about for-profit healthcare is that it doesn't follow traditional supply/demand dynamics.

It's not like most consumer goods, where demand decreases as price rises. The demand is almost static, if not increasing as the population ages.

No matter the price of healthcare, people will pay it, because they want to live. I can't imagine a price point that would make parents stop cancer treatments for a sick child, as an example.

STOP!

This thread is not the place to be pointing out economic reality.