For once I agree with PETA

RandFan

Mormon Atheist
RandFan
Joined
Dec 18, 2001
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Few take PETA to task more than I. However last night as I listened to a local talk show host interviewing a spokes person for PETA I was pleasantly surprised. He was talking about their new campaign to get commercial users of chicken meat to only use chickens killed by controlled-atmosphere killing (CAK), the least cruel method of slaughtering chickens ever developed.

McDonald's Makes Progress, KFC Continues to Ignore Critical Animal Welfare Measures

It was a bit incongruous to hear a person who is against killing of chickens recommending a method of killing chickens. However as he points out their goals are first to reduce suffering. He admitted that he did as a long range goal hope to end all production of animals for food.

I found the individual level headed. He did not have a superior attitude towards those who eat meat or even those who kill chickens. He had a lot of good to say about McDonalds. Surprise, surprise. He outlined why it was important for a corporation to be concerned about he bottom line and work to make profits for the share holders. If he disagreed with capitalism it didn't show. He simply pointed out that if PETA could show businesses like McDonalds that there was a more humane way to slaughter chickens then perhaps suffering could be reduced.

I don't know if PETA has truly changed but I could not find a single thing to disagree with the guy about. Folks, that is saying something. To be sure I have always believed that reducing suffering is a good thing. I just hate the morally superior attitude, the poor logic, bad tactical and strategical decisions and the dumb campaigns that are so moronic they defy comprehension

My hats off to PETA. Though to be sure, chicken for lunch sounds good.
 
RandFan said:
Few take PETA to task more than I. However last night as I listened to a local talk show host interviewing a spokes person for PETA I was pleasantly surprised. He was talking about their new campaign to get commercial users of chicken meat to only use chickens killed by controlled-atmosphere killing (CAK), the least cruel method of slaughtering chickens ever developed.
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Well, I'm not going to make a point about PETA, except that your statement seems a lot more sensible than what I have previously seen.

However, how is CAK less cruel than cutting their heads off? The cutting off of heads is pretty dramatic, but at least it's quick.
 
KFC doesn't slaughter chickens. They're a favorite target of PETA, and they've been called out on this before. I don't know about McDonalds, but I would guess they're like KFC: they get their chickens from Purdue or some other farming corporation. Those are the ones they should be targeting.
 
Re: Re: For once I agree with PETA

epepke said:
However, how is CAK less cruel than cutting their heads off? The cutting off of heads is pretty dramatic, but at least it's quick.
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CAK works by removing oxygen and replacing it with inert gas. The claim is that the science shows that animals like people and chickens who experince this first go to sleep and then die. No distress is measured during the process.

I don't know if it is true but PETA likes it. It is also claimed it could be cheaper and result in better meat.
 
I'm not going to take the effort to defend PETA. Carry on folks.
 
Re: Re: Re: For once I agree with PETA

RandFan said:
CAK works by removing oxygen and replacing it with inert gas. The claim is that the science shows that animals like people and chickens who experince this first go to sleep and then die. No distress is measured during the process.
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Hypoxia is a pretty easy way to die, provided that there are CO2 scrubbers there.

I don't know if it is true but PETA likes it. It is also claimed it could be cheaper and result in better meat.
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The better meat claim could be valid. It's possible that cutting off a chicken's head results in some stress hormones.

However, in the veterinary world, death by hypoxia is generally considered suboptimal. The most humane death is from an overdose of anesthetic. And, while I personally would not mind that in my chicken meat, some might.
 
I doubt that McDonalds is doing this to please PETA, that's just the PR reason. It's probably cheaper to gas them. This has been done in large turkey slaughterhouses for a while now. The main reason they did it for turkeys was to protect the workers from the beating wings during the traditional method - hanging them upside down and sticking a knife in their throat. As big as chickens are today, their wings can probably pack a wollop also.
 
WildCat said:
I doubt that McDonalds is doing this to please PETA, that's just the PR reason. It's probably cheaper to gas them. This has been done in large turkey slaughterhouses for a while now. The main reason they did it for turkeys was to protect the workers from the beating wings during the traditional method - hanging them upside down and sticking a knife in their throat. As big as chickens are today, their wings can probably pack a wollop also.
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My family raised chickens. I have personally slaughtered Hundreds of chickens. Not a point of pride or guilt just to help in understanding the following.

One day a very young turkey wandered into our yard. My mother immediately had me catch it and put it in the chicken coop. We raised it until the next Christmas when it fell on me to dispatch the extremely large bird. It seems turkeys do well on chicken feed. It also seems that they always get their share and more.

In any event I had to think through my assignment and come up with a plan. Having killed chickens I had a pretty good idea what would happen when I took the ax to the birds neck. So I tied a rope around the turkeys legs and threw the other end over a horizontal beam 5' off of the ground. I put a wood block under the turkeys neck and he didn't move an inch. At that moment I was immensely proud of my set up. Everything seemed perfect. So I brought the ax down sharply on the birds neck ready to grab the rope and host the turkey into the air and tie it off.

Ooops... once the turkey's head was severed it immediately began to flap its wings. The previously docile creature became an unexpected powerful opponent. It nocked me down twice and scratched my face and arms leaving me with many bruises and abrasions. I was covered from head to toe in blood from the turkey.

It tasted great. My mother suggested we get another for the following year. I told her that if we did that I would not be the one killing it.

We never did get another turkey and we never did figure out where it came from. None of our neighbors had turkeys.
 
RandFan said:
My family raised chickens. I have personally slaughtered Hundreds of chickens. Not a point of pride or guilt just to help in understanding the following.

One day a very young turkey wandered into our yard. My mother immediately had me catch it and put it in the chicken coop. We raised it until the next Christmas when it fell on me to dispatch the extremely large bird. It seems turkeys do well on chicken feed. It also seems that they always get their share and more.

In any event I had to think through my assignment and come up with a plan. Having killed chickens I had a pretty good idea what would happen when I took the ax to the birds neck. So I tied a rope around the turkeys legs and threw the other end over a horizontal beam 5' off of the ground. I put a wood block under the turkeys neck and he didn't move an inch. At that moment I was immensely proud of my set up. Everything seemed perfect. So I brought the ax down sharply on the birds neck ready to grab the rope and host the turkey into the air and tie it off.

Ooops... once the turkey's head was severed it immediately began to flap its wings. The previously docile creature became an unexpected powerful opponent. It nocked me down twice and scratched my face and arms leaving me with many bruises and abrasions. I was covered from head to toe in blood from the turkey.

It tasted great. My mother suggested we get another for the following year. I told her that if we did that I would not be the one killing it.

We never did get another turkey and we never did figure out where it came from. None of our neighbors had turkeys.
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Heartwarming. Like a kid's story. Except you did an Islam on the bird.;)
 
GIVE A BIG THANKS TO TEMPLE GRANDIN!!!!


She designs humane slaughter houses. Instead of going through government red tape and trying to change laws, she got McDonalds to agree to use only humane slaughter houses that met her very simple, but stringent standards.


From the NAIA web site


McDonald’s maintains that it is a leader in animal welfare concerns in the fast food industry. The company funded videos on humane animal handling methods for beef and pork processors that is distributed by the American Meat Institute Foundation. Grandin was a consultant on the project. Released in May, the videos emphasize the need to conduct regular audits of processing plants to make sure animals are handled humanely and to identify and correct problems. The videos are available from WATT Publications, (815) 734-9091. In July, Grandin noted in a report that plant audits she conducted for McDonald’s and others in 1999 showed a marked increase in compliance with humane handling standards over plants surveyed for USDA in 1996. Seventy-four percent of audited plants were compliant with the cattle stunning2 standards in 1999, up from 30 percent in 1996, and 78 percent were compliant with standards for vocalization3 this year compared to 38 percent in 1996.


“These summaries clearly show that the industry has improved,” Grandin wrote. “Audits conducted by McDonald’s Corporation have motivated the beef industry to improve handling and stunning of cattle.” Not all plants meet the standards, however, In October, McDonald’s suspended purchases from a plant that failed the audit.



PETA has said Temple Grandin has done more to ease suffering of animals than anyone else on earth today. And she did it without government intervention, and could only have done it because she is an autistic, able the "think" like an animal.

Changes can be made by one person, it doesn't take a government committee or a lot of money.
 
My mother suggested we get another for the following year. I told her that if we did that I would not be the one killing it.


You should have used the turkey preparation method employed in the Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers comic.
 
I remember seeing the Perdue chickens going off to slaughter! There would always be a few just hanging on to the outside of the cages....as a child I would roll down my car window and yell, "RUN RUN!" They never did.

I would say that the issue of cows had a lot to do with health issues and safety for the slaughter house workers. Also the mental health of the workers. To work in a quiet calm processing area is much more enjoyable than an unkept loud plant full of frantic cows.
 
Hey Road, you ever seen the chicken trucks with a few chickens just hanging on for the ride?

OK, so I had a boring childhood.
 
kittynh said:
Hey Road, you ever seen the chicken trucks with a few chickens just hanging on for the ride?

OK, so I had a boring childhood.
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True story: I had to pick up loads of chicken offal on occasion from a major processor here on the West Coast. The problem was that you pick this stuff up in open top end dump trailers.

Then, you have to run like hell to keep it from aging and stinking up the place, and you can't take your turns too hard, or it winds up on the road, and you catch hell from both County Mounties and CHP.

So, I'm pulling in to the plant, and a truck that's half full of birds is rolling out. One of the plant's guards tells me, "He didn't do a very good job of securing his load. Half of 'em escaped."

"Man, what a dumb cluck," I tell him.

Funny, no one wanted to talk to me for a while after that.
 
corplinx said:
They are chickens, get over it.
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But they show signs of distress. They're sentient. What difference does it make that they're chickens? It's not unreasonable to consider ways to minimize their suffering.
 
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