Finally! Ionic Breeze Article

[Starthinker]

Yahoo Article

I've been telling people since they came out not to buy them and even have pointed out to coworkers that their claim about the FDA declaring them "A newer way to clean air" means nothing, it only states that it's newer, not better than anything. Maybe an article like this will help, now.

I'd love to see these banned. I can't wait to see if/how they change their marketing to combat this. Their last response was to put some little device on the front that's supposed to make oxygen or something.

 

[Hagrok]

I believe they use air ionizors in Electro Static Discharge (ESD) safe work environments legitimately; so, banning them would be kind of silly.

I swear they mentioned that the last time I took my ESD training... then again, I could be making it up.

 

[Hellbound]

Yes, electrostatic systems can remove pollutants, this is not in contention. The problem with the Ionic Breeze systems was that they produced ozone. OVer time, this could build up to dangerous levels in enclosed spaces (like a house).

The add-on the put on them is supposed to remove the ozone. As to its effectiveness, I don't know.

Still think they're way overpriced, though

 

[tsg]

The add-on the put on them is supposed to remove the ozone.

The spin in the ads, though, is that the ozone being removed is coming from outside and not the air purifier.

 

[Dark Jaguar]

I recall similar devices a family member got that actually PROUDLY declaired they created o-zone, as though that was good for what ailes ya (cures your rickets and such, recommended by your local apothacary). When I pointed out that o-zone is great for our health only when it is at the very top of our atmosphere blocking UV, NOT when it is in our lungs, they doubted me. "It's oxygen isn't it?" Oh sure, but it's o3, we breathe o2! Big difference! When I finally get to the point where I use the analogy (since I lack enough information to really state what makes o3 act so differently) that table salt, a good for ya item, happens to be made of two very toxic ingrediants that work totally differently mixed together, I'm basically just brushed off. "Well I don't know!"

 

[Hellbound]

The spin in the ads, though, is that the ozone being removed is coming from outside and not the air purifier.

I wouldn't know, We have DVR, so I record my shows and skip commercials

 

[Meffy]

Seems to me that ozone's not just irritating to the mucous membranes, it's generally corrosive too -- makes fabrics and plastics deteriorate faster than usual, and so forth. I wonder how much property damage those little ozone emitters did before the outlet scrubber (whatever the heck it is) was retrofitted.

When I was very young I thought it was fascinating stuff. But when playing with miniature motors that don't make much ozone at a time, you don't get the full effect.

 

[luchog]

Yahoo Article

I've been telling people since they came out not to buy them and even have pointed out to coworkers that their claim about the FDA declaring them "A newer way to clean air" means nothing, it only states that it's newer, not better than anything. Maybe an article like this will help, now.

I'd love to see these banned. I can't wait to see if/how they change their marketing to combat this. Their last response was to put some little device on the front that's supposed to make oxygen or something.

Consumer Reports did a series of articles on the Ionic Breeze air cleaners, noting their complete failure to actually clean anything, their tencency to create potentially harmful levels of ozone, and the results of the defamation lawsuit filed against them by Sharper Image, the vendor of Ionic Breeze (the case was thrown out of court).

I'd like to the articles on CR, but they're subscription-only.

 

[Starthinker]

Consumer Reports did a series of articles on the Ionic Breeze air cleaners, noting their complete failure to actually clean anything, their tencency to create potentially harmful levels of ozone, and the results of the defamation lawsuit filed against them by Sharper Image, the vendor of Ionic Breeze (the case was thrown out of court).

I'd like to the articles on CR, but they're subscription-only.

Yes, but many times when CR pans something only the readers of CR knows about it. At least this way more people are made aware. I applauded them at the time, too.

 

[Just thinking]

Yahoo Article

I've been telling people since they came out not to buy them and even have pointed out to coworkers that their claim about the FDA declaring them "A newer way to clean air" means nothing, it only states that it's newer, not better than anything. Maybe an article like this will help, now.

I'd love to see these banned. I can't wait to see if/how they change their marketing to combat this. Their last response was to put some little device on the front that's supposed to make oxygen or something.

David Oreck must be tickled pink.

 

[DRBUZZ0]

My mother bought a couple of these units not long ago.

As for their effectiveness: Well, they do collect dust on the grids. Unfortionately, they don't seem to circulate enough air or grab enough dust to make much of a dent in a decent sized house. Perhaps in a small area they'd be noticable.

As for ozone: Yeah, I've heard a lot of devices tout their ability to produce ozone before. They claim it "freshens" the air. I've even seen an ozonator which claims to freshen air for cars. As far as ozone freshening air: I would doubt it. In small quantities, it's probably not very noticable and larger quantities could be unhealthy....

yes it does kill bacteria...but that's because it's toxic

So I guess now the thing is units which break down ozone? Here we go again. It's funny how things can come full circle like that.


Personally, I really do not like the smell of ozone. However, usually when I smell it (which is usually in my basement workshop), the ozone is the least of my worries. Generally the smell of ozone is followed by "Oh crap! Unplug it! Unplug it! Damn! What did I do with my 40kv lineman's gloves! DAMNIT. This is what I get for not bothering to use the isolation transformer!"

 

[macgyver]

Personally, I really do not like the smell of ozone. However, usually when I smell it (which is usually in my basement workshop), the ozone is the least of my worries. Generally the smell of ozone is followed by "Oh crap! Unplug it! Unplug it! Damn! What did I do with my 40kv lineman's gloves! DAMNIT. This is what I get for not bothering to use the isolation transformer!"

I know that smell! You probably let some smoke out of some components too, didn't you?

As for what O3 does to things; it BURNS them...literally. Oxygen...oxidize...rapid oxidation = burning

I found the best use for these "ionizers" is eliminating static charge...particularly the charge created by my coffee grinder that causes all the grounds to pop out of the container when I'm trying to measure coffee for my morning espresso. A zap with my old vinyl record de-static gun and voila! tame coffee grounds....

 

[Gravy]

Personally, I really do not like the smell of ozone. However, usually when I smell it (which is usually in my basement workshop), the ozone is the least of my worries. Generally the smell of ozone is followed by "Oh crap! Unplug it! Unplug it! Damn! What did I do with my 40kv lineman's gloves! DAMNIT. This is what I get for not bothering to use the isolation transformer!"

(Neighbors' lights dim again)
"Dammit, what is he DOING down there? That's it. I'm calling the cops this time."
"Honey, you're overreacting again. He's just tinkering."
"Tinkering? He's either growing a huge amount of pot or he's trying to bring the dead back to life with electricity."
"Stop it. Anyway, I like the smell. It smells fresh."
"Yeah, like fresh body parts being welded together. When the news crews show up, YOU can be the one to tell them what a seemingly nice, quite guy he was. And you want to have kids? With THAT going on next door?"

 

[alfaniner]

...
I found the best use for these "ionizers" is eliminating static charge...particularly the charge created by my coffee grinder that causes all the grounds to pop out of the container when I'm trying to measure coffee for my morning espresso. A zap with my old vinyl record de-static gun and voila! tame coffee grounds....

You mean that thing actually works?! I used one on my records all the time and it never seemed to do anything. But I kept using it...

 

[macgyver]

You mean that thing actually works?! I used one on my records all the time and it never seemed to do anything. But I kept using it...

Well....it works great on coffee grounds!

However, it did seem to work on my records too when combined with a brush to remove dust. The dust definitely came off the vinyl easier after zapping it with some ions (or ozone, or whatever was coming out of the gun...)

Apparently O3 is quite unstable, and simply breaks down to O2 on it's own. 2 x 03 = 3 x 02

I also read that the smell is a result of electrons being released during the formation of the ozone, and that the ozone has no odour of it's own?

 

[Psi Baba]

(Neighbors' lights dim again)
"Dammit, what is he DOING down there? That's it. I'm calling the cops this time."

That's funny to me because I did have to call the electric company on a neighbor once for similar reasons. My lights were dimming one evening. The weather was good, no storms, and not hot enough for everyone to be running air conditioners. There was no ordinary reason for that to be happening . . . except the weirdo next-door neighbor. I looked out a back window toward his detached garage and sure enough I saw blue lightning eminating from the garage windows. I guess he was using an arc-welder or something equally insidious. I immediately called the electric company who were very apologetic about the situtation and said that the transformer at the end of street might not be adequate. The next day they were outside installing a new transformer near my house! Now that's service. But I no longer live there so the crazy neighbor is someone else's problem.

OnTopic: The thing that bothered me about the ionic breeze commercial is that they attempt to show how easy it is to clean it--by wiping off the outside surfaces of two of the four "collection" plates that appear to be about an inch apart. What about the other six surfaces? How do you clean those? Not so easy is it?

 

[Meffy]

Apparently O3 is quite unstable, and simply breaks down to O2 on it's own. 2 x 03 = 3 x 02

My understanding -- and anyone knowing otherwise, please correct me -- is that the ozone breaks down into an ordinary oxygen molecule plus a free oxygen atom. It's the single atom that makes ozone so corrosive, as it will oxidize other materials "as is," as opposed to molecular oxygen which has a bond which must be broken before the oxygen atoms can do their dirty work.

The oxygen atom can combine with another ozone atom, yielding two oxygen molecules. It can bond with another free oxygen directly. Or it can oxidize some other material. The ones that don't recombine with oxygen -- those are the ones that wreak mischief on tissues and other materials.

 

[macgyver]

My understanding -- and anyone knowing otherwise, please correct me -- is that the ozone breaks down into an ordinary oxygen molecule plus a free oxygen atom. It's the single atom that makes ozone so corrosive, as it will oxidize other materials "as is," as opposed to molecular oxygen which has a bond which must be broken before the oxygen atoms can do their dirty work.

The oxygen atom can combine with another ozone atom, yielding two oxygen molecules. It can bond with another free oxygen directly. Or it can oxidize some other material. The ones that don't recombine with oxygen -- those are the ones that wreak mischief on tissues and other materials.

I'm not an expert, and I simply "wiki'd" the info I gave. However, I understand that the stable molecule is O2, and the radicals are 0 and 03?

Given that O3 would break down to components, those components would most likely recombine to form O2 unless, I suppose, the free radical had something else to combine with? (ie lung tissue).

An expert's input would be most welcome!

 

[Meffy]

O2 seems to be the most common outcome, and in free air it's apparently "what happens." The cases that interest me are those involving oxidization of solid materials.

I too would like to hear from a chemist who knows at first hand about ozone's reactions.

Correction: In my previous post I referred to an "ozone atom." Please read that as an oxygen atom. I suppose it's the same thing but, well... :-D

 

[Just thinking]

Correction: In my previous post I referred to an "ozone atom." Please read that as an oxygen atom. I suppose it's the same thing but, well... :-D

Well, there really is no such thing as an Ozone Atom -- it would be an atom of oxygen -- and it would be the same whether it came from O2 or O3. Both O2 and O3 are molecules, commonly referred to as Oxygen and Ozone. However, if one was referring specifically to an atom of oxygen that came from an Ozone molecule, it might be called an Ozone's atom of oxygen.

-- Oxygen

-- Ozone