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Competitiveness in US high schools?

Luciana

Skeptical Carioca
Joined
Aug 5, 2001
Messages
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Rio de Janeiro - RJ
Everytime I hear Americans describing their high school, almost invariably I hear things like "competitiveness", "cliques", "popularity contests". And I keep wondering what they mean, or at least to what extent those things happen?

Of course my school had their share of bullies, but it rarely got physical. It was verbal abuse, mostly. The worst that happened (and it was bad!), was kids hiding each other's books and other material. So the poor kid would leave for break and somebody else would get his pencil case and hide it right before drawing lesson. So the poor kid looked stumped at not finding it, the teacher would notice, the kid would start to look around with everybody laughing. Worse was when the boys would pass around the kid's book, and leave him in the middle making a full of himself and having to beg.

Competitiveness regarding grades? Exams would be handed to the kid and no one else saw it. Some kids would compare grades themselves, but most did not care. At worst it could be mocking material, like the boy who was the teacher's pet and yet got a very low grade. Verbal abuse would ensue.

Sports... we had the option of doing physical exercise and not team games. So the scrawny boys and distracted ladies could do those and not get teased for being incompetent. I was one of those. Balls, for me, are entirely meaningless, why should I hit them in any way? I know team sports are mandatory in some schools, inwhich case they have an "advanced" team and others for everybody else. I don't remember being a matter of life and death to anyone to participate in those.

"Being cool" involved being good-looking or sharp-witted, having cool stuff and getting invited to all parties. But even then there was not this "caste" system I understand there is in the US. People had their closest friends, two, three, four, they were not identified as part of a "clique" as in goths, jocks, etc.

Bear in mind that we all wear uniforms, so if you were "goth" or "grunge" you could at most play with accessories. I believe it downplayed the importance of appearance a little, because even the poorest kid could look fine, and the richest kid could never look very rich. So at least the cliques lost a lot of its "visual" side.

So am I having the right impression? Is that level of competitiveness in US schools desirable, do you think it could be positive for the formation of an individual? And why is that so?
 
I have said before, my school (and particularly my class) competed at being underachievers. The more you could get away with not doing, the better you were viewed.

For me, it made a really big impact through my freshman and sophomore years. As I grew up, I gave up worrying about that crap and just did what I felt like doing. Still didn't do much, but didn't so blatently sabotage my learning like I did previously. For example, I actually started doing some of the assigned homework on occasion. Never did any of that freshman or sophomore year.
 
competitiveness is kind of ingrained into our society, school isn't the only place. so it's kind of hard to explain to someone not raised in it, but in pretty much whatever we do here in the U.S. we're competing with someone or something.
 
I think it depends a lot on the school.

I'm surprised to hear about these schools- in my high school (where I'm still going) no one cares about how athletic you are, and bullying, especially physical bullying, is pretty rare. What matters, in a twisted, irritating way, is college.

Students at my school compete from the moment they start freshman year- trying to find the clubs that will look good for college, trying to grub for the best grades they can, buying SAT prep books by the cartload... it's kind of pathetic. Kids with an SAT score that isn't as high as their friends, or who go to colleges that aren't on the top 50 in rankings, are made to feel like they have something to be ashamed of.

If you don't believe people this shallow can exist, check out the forums at www.collegeconfidential.org. Common discussions include "Is my score high enough," "What is a good essay topic," and even "What is a lucky meal to eat right before you check whether you were admitted."

I'm glad I'm out of that mess.
 
From my experience in a white-kids-with-too-much-money high school in a suburb within commuting distance from NYC, any academic competetion there was was entirely non-personal. It helped that the school was small enough that people weren't really competing for positions at the same colleges. Same goes for sports and such - we were lucky enough to cobble enough people together to form a team for any given sport, so that it seems there was very little personal conflict going on.

Cliques and popularity contests are completely different topics, things that exist outside of the school and are brought by the students into them.
 
You can find competition wherever you find jerks. Which means just throw a brick and you'll hit at least five of them.

Some people got mad at me my senior year in high school because I moved the summer before and threw off the class rankings from the previous year's end. I liked getting good grades, but I didn't give a rat's shapely posterior what anybody else's grades were. Yet some people cared a lot. One guy wound up suing the school because of the way they calculated class rank for valedictorian at the semester break and not the end of the year. Apparently because of the microscopic weighting given to AP classes, he would have been valedictorian instead of the girl who was. It seemed rather stupid to me, since by that time everyone had already been accepted into college anyway.
 
You can find competition wherever you find jerks. Which means just throw a brick and you'll hit at least five of them.

Some people got mad at me my senior year in high school because I moved the summer before and threw off the class rankings from the previous year's end. I liked getting good grades, but I didn't give a rat's shapely posterior what anybody else's grades were. Yet some people cared a lot. One guy wound up suing the school because of the way they calculated class rank for valedictorian at the semester break and not the end of the year. Apparently because of the microscopic weighting given to AP classes, he would have been valedictorian instead of the girl who was. It seemed rather stupid to me, since by that time everyone had already been accepted into college anyway.

Ever heard this story? It made some headlines a few years back. Go ahead, laugh at the expense of overachievers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blair_Hornstine
 
competitiveness is kind of ingrained into our society, school isn't the only place. so it's kind of hard to explain to someone not raised in it, but in pretty much whatever we do here in the U.S. we're competing with someone or something.

"Valedictorian", that TM just used above. Also, "prom king" and "prom queen" (and the whole prom thing, that apparently requires expensive clothing and a data), "cheerleaders"... what else? So few must profit from such a system, and yet so many seem to loath it! There must be sth wrong with this concept.
 
At the school that I went to there were cliques and elitist groups but underlying it all there was a sense of unity of the entire student body. I doubt that anything resembling that exists anymore. We all had our groups that we hung out with but when it came down to it we were all one big dysfunctional family and to a large extent we held other students regardless of their cliques as fellow students deserving of our consideration when it came to matters of teachers or parents. One of the routine examples was the fights. A student would get into a fight with another student and they would arrange a time and place like "lunch time, behind the gym". Word would pass around among the students and at lunch a large number of students would simultaneously migrate to the behind the gym. There might be more than 200 students and they would surround the fighters elbow to elbow and keep teachers and administrators from breaking up the fight before it was over. No one would ever tell the authorities what was happening before the fight.
 
Everytime I hear Americans describing their high school, almost invariably I hear things like "competitiveness", "cliques", "popularity contests". And I keep wondering what they mean, or at least to what extent those things happen?

Of course my school had their share of bullies, but it rarely got physical. It was verbal abuse, mostly. The worst that happened (and it was bad!), was kids hiding each other's books and other material. So the poor kid would leave for break and somebody else would get his pencil case and hide it right before drawing lesson. So the poor kid looked stumped at not finding it, the teacher would notice, the kid would start to look around with everybody laughing. Worse was when the boys would pass around the kid's book, and leave him in the middle making a full of himself and having to beg.

Competitiveness regarding grades? Exams would be handed to the kid and no one else saw it. Some kids would compare grades themselves, but most did not care. At worst it could be mocking material, like the boy who was the teacher's pet and yet got a very low grade. Verbal abuse would ensue.

Sports... we had the option of doing physical exercise and not team games. So the scrawny boys and distracted ladies could do those and not get teased for being incompetent. I was one of those. Balls, for me, are entirely meaningless, why should I hit them in any way? I know team sports are mandatory in some schools, inwhich case they have an "advanced" team and others for everybody else. I don't remember being a matter of life and death to anyone to participate in those.

"Being cool" involved being good-looking or sharp-witted, having cool stuff and getting invited to all parties. But even then there was not this "caste" system I understand there is in the US. People had their closest friends, two, three, four, they were not identified as part of a "clique" as in goths, jocks, etc.

Bear in mind that we all wear uniforms, so if you were "goth" or "grunge" you could at most play with accessories. I believe it downplayed the importance of appearance a little, because even the poorest kid could look fine, and the richest kid could never look very rich. So at least the cliques lost a lot of its "visual" side.

So am I having the right impression? Is that level of competitiveness in US schools desirable, do you think it could be positive for the formation of an individual? And why is that so?
Same in Denmark, except for the school uniforms. No geeks, nerds or jocks here. Up until the 10th grade there were just "classes". I.e. a group of children who had been together more or less since kindergarten and identified with their class. Each class might have some animosity against another class, but individuals within each class, though they were of different abilities, were just members of your class.

I can't say I find much to like about the American system. And I've tried both.
 
I think it depends a lot on the school.

I'm surprised to hear about these schools- in my high school (where I'm still going) no one cares about how athletic you are, and bullying, especially physical bullying, is pretty rare. What matters, in a twisted, irritating way, is college.

Students at my school compete from the moment they start freshman year- trying to find the clubs that will look good for college, trying to grub for the best grades they can, buying SAT prep books by the cartload... it's kind of pathetic. Kids with an SAT score that isn't as high as their friends, or who go to colleges that aren't on the top 50 in rankings, are made to feel like they have something to be ashamed of.
Your high school was the complete opposite of mine. At my high school, if you weren't an athlete or a cheerleader, you were nothing. They'd have sports banquets and awards nights for sports and they had absolutely no acknowledgement of good students. They didn't even have a National Honor Society. Good grades and academic achievement weren't valued -- I was sooo glad to get out of that place.
 

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