• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Childbirth questions

stealpick

Student
S
Joined
Jun 14, 2004
Messages
33
A couple of questions for those of you who have children.

My wife and I are due to have our first child in January. After talking to her doctor (but mostly after reading tons of pages on the Internet), she's decided to forego the epidural and try natural childbirth. I've spoken to a doctor friend of mine who tells me that there's little to no chance of the epidural getting into the baby's system, so my first thought was to convince my wife to save herself the pain and get the shot. But after pondering it some more, I figured that it's her body and her decision. If she wants to go natural, that's her choice. So question 1: anybody have any strong feelings one way or another on epidurals? Should I try to convince her otherwise?

Now, as a result of going natural, she's signed us up for Lamaze classes. I know next to nothing about Lamaze and have paid very little attention to it in the past, what with the whole being childless thing, but the little I've heard about it really strikes me as slightly woo-ish. Now, I've been told that Lamaze classes are not the same as birthing classes, which supposedly can get into really touchy-feely discussions about things like what music you want to have playing during the delivery, burying the placenta in the backyard, etc. Lamaze, as I understand it, is primarily about breathing. I haven't been able to find any critical discussions on Lamaze so far--the most I've come across are people who say that the nurses at the hospital can pretty much tell the woman everything she needs to know before she gives birth. So question 2: Can anyone here elaborate on Lamaze?

Lastly, my wife is also interested in hiring a doula to assist with the childbirth. I'd never even heard this term before she mentioned it, but as I understand it, a doula is a woman experienced in childbirth who gives emotional support to the mother and tries to make her more comfortable during the delivery. My wife gave me some literature on doula's, but as soon as I saw the phrase "ancient tradition" a red flag went up. So last question: Should I pay for a doula? If it makes my wife more comfortable, it sounds reasonable, but I really fear that we're going to have some woman standing in the delivery room telling us how to appreciate the experience of childbirth, when it seems like this is going to be one of the most personal experiences of our lives, and I'd rather not have any unnecessary people there.

Bottom line, I want my wife to be as comfortable as possible, I want my baby to be healthy, and I want to experience this birth with only the necessary people in the room. Whaddya guys think?
 
There are a lot of web sites that discuss these issues. One source is PubMed, which also has links to other relevant medical articles.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=AbstractPlus&list_uids=8826170&query_hl=2&itool=pubmed_docsum
This explains how epidurals are safe and effective, but results in a more prolonged labour. The main risk is that this produces delays in delivery, prompting a 2-3 fold increase in the need for a caesarian section or some other operative intervention like forceps delivery.
Also try here.

As regarding a "birthing partner" I guess its something you need to decide yourselves. With your first baby, things can be a bit tense and everything seems as though its out of control. Having a calm, reassuring helper might be a good idea if you are both the types who might be anxious about it. But that person is an extra body in the room as you say, and might detract from any intimacy between the pair of you. If your delivery team are supportive and you have good midwife/nurses around, it might be quite unnecessary.

I guess its your call, but rather than discuss it with strangers on the internet, why not discuss it with friends who 1) have had kids and 2)know you both and how you might react in the scenario of a delivery and might know better than us what might seem good for you.
 
stealpick said:
A couple of questions for those of you who have children.

My wife and I are due to have our first child in January. After talking to her doctor (but mostly after reading tons of pages on the Internet), she's decided to forego the epidural and try natural childbirth. I've spoken to a doctor friend of mine who tells me that there's little to no chance of the epidural getting into the baby's system, so my first thought was to convince my wife to save herself the pain and get the shot. But after pondering it some more, I figured that it's her body and her decision. If she wants to go natural, that's her choice. So question 1: anybody have any strong feelings one way or another on epidurals? Should I try to convince her otherwise?
Click to expand...

Don't push for her to change her mind at this point. Just make it clear that she's allowed to change her mind at any time during the delivery as long as it's feasible to do so. My first child, I wanted to go natural, but it ended up being a long and painful delivery. I eventually asked for the epidural, which ended up making it possible for me to have a normal delivery. My doctor told me that without it, I'd have been too exhausted to push the baby out when the time came and would have needed a C-section.

OTOH, with my second child, I planned to have an epidural, but he came too fast and there were so many deliveries going on at the time, that by the time the anethesiologist was available, I was too far into it to get the epidural, so I ended up having natural childbirth. So, whatever is planned may have to change. Just be supportive of whatever your wife wants during the delivery.

Now, as a result of going natural, she's signed us up for Lamaze classes. ... Lamaze, as I understand it, is primarily about breathing. I haven't been able to find any critical discussions on Lamaze so far--the most I've come across are people who say that the nurses at the hospital can pretty much tell the woman everything she needs to know before she gives birth. So question 2: Can anyone here elaborate on Lamaze?
Click to expand...

I'd agree that the nurses can tell you what you need to know, but the purpose of Lamaze classes is also to practice the breathing techniques so that your wife is very familiar with actually performing the different breathing techniques before she goes into delivery. Just knowing the basics of what you are supposed to do is different from being able to do it with competence in adverse and unfamiliar circumstances, so practice can help.

Lastly, my wife is also interested in hiring a doula to assist with the childbirth.
Click to expand...

I'm don't know anything about doulas, so can't help you there. Good luck. I hope everything goes well for you.
 
Over forty years ago when I had my children we did not have all the choices that are available today! It must be pretty confusing at times. I'm glad I had them naturally (with just the occasionl breath of gas and air) and I was very lucky to be able to do so. I was living abroad at the time and there were no classes to go to, but I think that would have been helpful. All best wishes.
 
I did natural childbirth all three times, but I have a high tolerance for pain having been a sufferer of severe migraines since the age of 14. In my limited experience of other mommies I know, epidurals do tend to prolong the pushing stage. My sons were pushed out in:

#1 son--30 minutes
#2 son--5 contractions (he was almost born in the car at the side of the freeway)
#3 son--10 minutes.

My sis-in-law had an epidural and her daughter had to be born via vacuum extraction after 2 hours of pushing got her nowhere.

I did not do Lamaze. I did the Bradley Method. Looking at it now, I see more 'woo' phrases than I did then, OTOH, I got through a combined total of 31 hours of labor with no drugs.

There's nothing inherently wrong with a doula. As long as she isn't trying to force your wife into natural childbirth if she feels she needs the epidural.
 
stealpick said:
A couple of questions for those of you who have children.

My wife and I are due to have our first child in January. After talking to her doctor (but mostly after reading tons of pages on the Internet), she's decided to forego the epidural and try natural childbirth. I've spoken to a doctor friend of mine who tells me that there's little to no chance of the epidural getting into the baby's system, so my first thought was to convince my wife to save herself the pain and get the shot. But after pondering it some more, I figured that it's her body and her decision. If she wants to go natural, that's her choice. So question 1: anybody have any strong feelings one way or another on epidurals? Should I try to convince her otherwise?

Now, as a result of going natural, she's signed us up for Lamaze classes. I know next to nothing about Lamaze and have paid very little attention to it in the past, what with the whole being childless thing, but the little I've heard about it really strikes me as slightly woo-ish. Now, I've been told that Lamaze classes are not the same as birthing classes, which supposedly can get into really touchy-feely discussions about things like what music you want to have playing during the delivery, burying the placenta in the backyard, etc. Lamaze, as I understand it, is primarily about breathing. I haven't been able to find any critical discussions on Lamaze so far--the most I've come across are people who say that the nurses at the hospital can pretty much tell the woman everything she needs to know before she gives birth. So question 2: Can anyone here elaborate on Lamaze?

Lastly, my wife is also interested in hiring a doula to assist with the childbirth. I'd never even heard this term before she mentioned it, but as I understand it, a doula is a woman experienced in childbirth who gives emotional support to the mother and tries to make her more comfortable during the delivery. My wife gave me some literature on doula's, but as soon as I saw the phrase "ancient tradition" a red flag went up. So last question: Should I pay for a doula? If it makes my wife more comfortable, it sounds reasonable, but I really fear that we're going to have some woman standing in the delivery room telling us how to appreciate the experience of childbirth, when it seems like this is going to be one of the most personal experiences of our lives, and I'd rather not have any unnecessary people there.

Bottom line, I want my wife to be as comfortable as possible, I want my baby to be healthy, and I want to experience this birth with only the necessary people in the room. Whaddya guys think?
Click to expand...
Watch the british bbc show Coupling.

Watch the episodes called "Circus of the epidurals"

She should be cured instantly. :D
http://www.bbc.co.uk/comedy/coupling/episodes/s4ep4.shtml
 
SusanB-M1 said:
Over forty years ago when I had my children we did not have all the choices that are available today! It must be pretty confusing at times. I'm glad I had them naturally (with just the occasionl breath of gas and air) and I was very lucky to be able to do so. I was living abroad at the time and there were no classes to go to, but I think that would have been helpful. All best wishes.
Click to expand...

That's actually something that's been on my mind a lot too--the incredible range of choices and options for delivery. I mean, humans have been giving birth since the beginning of, well, humans, right? Do we really need ALL these different options? Of course, I understand the advantages of being in a clean delivery room with a doctor as opposed to giving birth at home with a midwife tearing up sheets and boiling water, but it seems really difficult to find the point at which to draw the line where you can say, "This is everything we need for this delivery."

Deetee: thanks very much for the links. It really seems like epidurals are pretty safe, but the women who choose to do without them do so mostly because they don't want to prolong the delivery.

Beth: Were you in any major pain or discomfort during your second child's birth? If you could go back to that moment with the option of getting the epidural, would you choose to do so? This is a pain that I will never experience so I'm very interested in hearing the opinions of those who have gone through it.
 
I went natural for all three. It hurt. Lots. But I survived.

Also took Lamaze. It was good because they let you know how the baby sits inside, and a little about muscle groups, what to expect. I never had too much woo in lamaze, but that could differ by who is presenting. I had a registered nurse, and the classes were in a medical clinic. They took us on a tour of the hospital. They were big on going natural, no drugs, except for the gas. So that's what I did. You really had to ask otherwise. They wouldn't just offer it at any time.

I have no idea about a doula, but as long as it is still in the hospital, then it shouldn't be too much of a worry.

I wonder what the epidural would be like. My sister in law had one, and she was in overall labour for less time for her first child than I was for any of my three. She looked more unscathed too, darn it! Less popped vessels around the eyes, etc.
 
stealpick said:
Beth: Were you in any major pain or discomfort during your second child's birth?
Click to expand...
YES!

If you could go back to that moment with the option of getting the epidural, would you choose to do so? This is a pain that I will never experience so I'm very interested in hearing the opinions of those who have gone through it.
Click to expand...

No. Because I now know that the part with the most severe pain wouldn't actually last very long. Once I through the transitional labor, the pain during the actual delivery wasn't near as bad. Were I to have another child (I won't), I'd probably go the natural childbirth route again. But I would also stay open to the possibility of using anethesia if I felt I needed it.
 
stealpick said:
That's actually something that's been on my mind a lot too--the incredible range of choices and options for delivery. I mean, humans have been giving birth since the beginning of, well, humans, right? Do we really need ALL these different options? Of course, I understand the advantages of being in a clean delivery room with a doctor as opposed to giving birth at home with a midwife tearing up sheets and boiling water, but it seems really difficult to find the point at which to draw the line where you can say, "This is everything we need for this delivery."
Click to expand...

Look at traditional infant and maternal mortality rates and you can certainly see that there have been problems with the process for a long time.
 
IANAD (I Am Not A Doctor), I can only give you anecdotal evidence of what my friends and family have gone through, and what my wife and I went through 5 weeks ago.

My wife had planned for a natural birth, without epidural, but when the time came, she was in so much pain, she opted for the intervention after all. Unfortunately, hard labour came on too fast to get one, and even more unfortunately, pushing lasted over 4 hours. :( I would imagine the epidural would have made the process much less difficult.

We went with midwives, which are essentially doulas and doctors rolled into one... The midwives helped my wife with pain management techniques, and also delivered the baby. It was great for us, because the midwives were there during the entire process. In Ontario at least, the doctor and nurses are basically there right before delivery, and leave soon after.

I found Prenatal classes to be quite interesting. Not sure how much the techniques we learned actually helped when the time came, but at least all of the birthing videos desensitized me to the actual birth. :)

Mainly, I would suggest doing tons and tons of research on the net, even if it's just for interest's sake. The pregnancy and birthing process is absolutely fascinating!
 
ponderingturtle said:
Look at traditional infant and maternal mortality rates and you can certainly see that there have been problems with the process for a long time.
Click to expand...
It is also believed that the reason that interventions are becoming more and more important is that due to superior prenatal health, babies are being born much larger.

Considering the nice fat healthy babies that are born nowadays, it's certainly a nice problem to have. :)
 
I had three babies, all without epidurals. My youngest just turned 2. I am quite risk-averse and actually have a low tolerance for pain, in general.

I chose not to have epidurals based on data regarding the likelihood of other interventions after having an epidural, as well as the (low, but non-zero) risks of the procedure. I figured an epidural wouldn't save my life, just save me some pain, so if I could find another way of dealing with the pain, an epidural would be unnecessary. Having made my decision, I did what I could to implement it.

Preparation: Know everything you can about the process. Watch videos of natural births. Knowing it's painful and sometimes scary for the mom (especially that transition part) makes it easier to get through (or support her through) when the time comes. I learned about relaxation, and rehearsed words/thoughts/images that might help me get through the tough parts. Not so much woo as tricking/training my mind. We both read several childbirth books and we took 1/2 a course on the Bradley method, which has no special breathing techniques. Lamaze kind of turned me off (before I learned much about it) with the breathing, counting, and staring at photos of things unrelated to the birth. I do better by concentrating on what's going on than by trying to get my mind off it. YMMV. In the end, I learned almost everything I used from reading books and watching childbirth videos (and just plain knowing myself).

Skilled assistance: I loved my midwives, but far more important to me was having a close friend who knew how to talk to me and knew a lot about childbirth. She was there for #1 and #2, and I was there for both of hers. If she had not been there, I'd have had a doula (one carefully chosen for a fit with my worldview -- I wasn't interested in sacred birth or tantra or anything). For #3, husband did a great job, but I think he learned a lot during the first two births. While an epidural might have taken away some of the pain, the skill of my attendants and my confidence in them helped me cope with it.

Location: I chose to give birth in a freestanding birth center. I didn't have the option of an epidural without transferring (in labor) from the freestanding birth center to the hospital. I could have chosen to give birth in the hospital with the same midwives and the option of an epidural, but I didn't feel like I'd need it, and I preferred the birth center in general. If I (or my baby) needed lifesaving, I'd be transported to the hospital, and I trusted the expertise of my attendants. I did REALLY love having a jacuzzi to float in during the hard labor and transition. Between the water, dim lighting, and quiet coaching, I got through the pain (all three times) and even managed to have a sense of humor between pushing contractions.

If I had another, I wouldn't change a thing about my planning. I would definitely make sure I had a deep tub or pool to labor in, and someone to stay by my side at all times (someone *in addition to* the person running to fetch a wet washcloth, a drink, or a nurse/midwife/doctor).

All that said, if a woman thinks she'll need or want an epidural, she'll probably get one (if she's in the right place at the right time). And there are probably women who didn't intend to get an epidural, but later found that it was just the ticket. Start with a plan, and update it as necessary.

Good luck! What a world of change you are in for. :)
 
What Eos said...

We used Lamaze when my son was born many years ago. Not woo, at least back then. Good information that helps condition the mother to be more comfortable. Doing the exercises over several months helps prepare for the process.

I could teach you everything you need to be a good sprinter in about 5 minutes. But to be a good sprinter you have to practice to build up your endurance and your muscles. Same principle with Lamaze.
 
There are a couple of types of doulas. I looked into it recently. They are just helpers and advocates - like if your wife is not always good at speaking up and insisting on what she wants, the doula will help her and carry out her requests.

Some of them help do chores at your house after the birth - that would help enormously!!

Regarding pain management, just make sure your wife knows what options are available to her where you're planning to have the baby, and has in mind plan A, plan B, and plan C. It's not just epidurals or nothing; there are short-acting narcotics like Nubain. Breathing and massage techniques help with focus and some pain control, too.

Best wishes for a lovely, healthy baby!
 
stealpick said:
My wife and I LOVE that show! We watched those episodes close to a year ago. Maybe it's time for another viewing. :) I was actually pretty disappointed that the series ended after those episodes. Then again, it wasn't quite the same when Jeff left.
Click to expand...
Well, stop being dissapointed, the series hasn't ended.

Season 5 starts next year. :D
 
I had three babies, and no epidurals. For child #2 I wanted one (due to the memory of spending 90 minutes of the 6 hour labor pushing out Child #1's very large Dutch head), but the window of opportunity was too short. Child #3 came too fast for anything. Also, the tolerance for pain is a very individual thing.

Do not worry... go to the classes with your wife. That way you will learn all sorts of things.

Also, should something go wrong... the staff will be quick to work for a happy conclusion. During the classes for our first child, the hospital staff teaching it assured everyone even though the birthing center was very chic, with labor, delivery, recovery and baby rooming all in the SAME room... they were fully capable of performing a caesarian quickly (including rolling the bed into the elevator straight down to the operating theater).
 
mommyrex said:
I had three babies, all without epidurals. My youngest just turned 2. I am quite risk-averse and actually have a low tolerance for pain, in general.

I chose not to have epidurals based on data regarding the likelihood of other interventions after having an epidural, as well as the (low, but non-zero) risks of the procedure. I figured an epidural wouldn't save my life, just save me some pain, so if I could find another way of dealing with the pain, an epidural would be unnecessary. Having made my decision, I did what I could to implement it.
Click to expand...

You know, a lot of people around here claim that they're rational, but it's a welcome change to read a post from someone describing a thought process that actually is rational as opposed to being a rationalization.
 
I know you are going to ignore me. But just in case I am wrong.

My sister and I were both born at home. That was normal for the UK 50 years ago. Advantage is that there is no stress going to a hospital and a strange room. Of course if things go wrong...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom