Are Truthers "Jihad Apologists"?

[Walter Ego]

The phrase was coined by my knowledge by Gravy who seldom posts here anymore. I would say jihad apology is not the truthers goal or motivation but rather their effect.

Truthers seem to believe there is no terrorist attack that was not a false flag operation or that terrorist organizations if they exist are actually the creation of the U.S. government which itself is merely an arm of some shadowy international NWO elite.

Truther actually see themselves as patriotic. While I don't think you can say they are consciously aiding or abetting our enemies in the Muslim world, you could say, as was said of the late senator Joe McCarthy, they couldn't be doing a better a better job if they were actually employed by the other side.

(I exaggerate. The truthers can only wish they had the effect Tail Gunner Joe had in his day!)

 

[Scott Sommers]

Yes, and I can provide endless quotes from them attesting to this.

 

[Thunder]

yes, some indeed are.

 

[sheeplesnshills]

The phrase was coined by my knowledge by Gravy who seldom posts here anymore. I would say jihad apology is not the truthers goal or motivation but rather their effect.

Truthers seem to believe there is no terrorist attack that was not a false flag operation or that terrorist organizations if they exist are actually the creation of the U.S. government which itself is merely an arm of some shadowy international NWO elite.

Truther actually see themselves as patriotic. While I don't think you can say they are aiding or abetting our enemies in the Muslim world, you could say, as was said of the late senator Joe McCarthy, they couldn't be doing a better a better job if they were actually employed by the other side.

(I exaggerate. The truthers can only wish they had the effect Tail Gunner Joe had in his day!)

No I don't think they are as most if not all don't even acknowledge that jihadists even exist............and even if they did exist they would be incapable of flying a plane.

 

[Macgyver1968]

No...I think many revel in their "special knowledge" of an inside job. They feel special for knowing something that the general public does not know.

 

[Walter Ego]

Yes, and I can provide endless quotes from them attesting to this.

Can you post some of them? Is their intention to let the terrorists off the hook?

An apologist is a person who argues to defend or justify some policy or institution. In which case truthers must believe terrorists did attack the U.S. on 9/11 and are trying to justify such an attack.

But this is precisely, if they are being honest, what they don't believe.

 

[angrysoba]

As you say "apologism" is about justifying actions and most Truthers ostensibly don't believe that jihadists committed 9/11.

That said the very concepts of "truth" and "falsity" are ones that Truthers have demonstrated time and again to have a very faint grasp of. The same goes for rationality. In my experience Truthers tend to treat these things as some kind of fantasy game. I am sure that most of them know, deep down, that what they are saying is bollocks and that they know full well that the US government and/or Israel were not responsible for the attacks but they really, really wish it were true and so they are quite happy to blithely fabricate evidence for "9/11 Truth" and then appear to genuinely believe what they have fabricated.

Their mental world is deeply confused and deeply murky, IMHO.

 

[angrysoba]

Furthermore, if you really push and push the Truthers to tell you what they would think if it were true and jihadis really had carried out 9/11 I would bet you good money that in most cases they would say, "Well if they really did do it then we deserved it." Or some variant on that.

 

[Scott Sommers]

If I read the post correctly, it is not really about the events of September 11, 2001. It is not related to who did or did not attack the WTC buildings and other targets. It is about what kind of people Truthers are.

There are Jihadists. They exist in the Middle East and elsewhere. They are involved in attacks on cafes, military bases, and anonymous civilians in Israel, Iraq, and other places.

The question address whether or not Truthers are apologists for these people. Many Truthers believe that the so-called 911 inside job-thing did not happen but that numerous Muslims do kill people, including civilians, because they are being forced to fight against a faceless entity called the New World Order. So while they are like Truthers in combating the NWO, the Jihadists did not attack the WTC buildings. In fact, they are only involved in fighting and killing because they are resisting the NWO expansion - or something like that. Truthers make numerous statements to this effect, they regularly state they are the real patriots of the USA, and they communicate regularly with entities that broadcast anti-American communications.

Do you agree with me? And if you do, would you still like examples of their statements?

In fact, I will take this further. If you want the best examples, go to Truther's Facebook accounts and ask them. They will answer your questions directly about this. I do not mean Dick Gage (although he has a Facebook account). If you want better Truthers to talk to about this, I will give you their names. But they will not hide these facts from you. They seem to feel proud of this. After all, they (and Ron Paul) are real patriots fighting for an American way of life.

 

[Walter Ego]

In my experience Truthers tend to treat these things as some kind of fantasy game. I am sure that most of them know, deep down, that what they are saying is bollocks and that they know full well that the US government and/or Israel were not responsible for the attacks but they really, really wish it were true and so they are quite happy to blithely fabricate evidence for "9/11 Truth" and then appear to genuinely believe what they have fabricated.

So you are saying truthers are, consciously or unconsciously, insincere? And they, at their deepest level, don't believe their BS and would acknowledge it is BS if they were honest?

I would agree that they live in a fantasy world and mistake this self-created world for reality. Why they do so cannot be so easily answered, however.

 

[The Platypus]

Traitors, is what they are.

 

[Scott Sommers]

So you are saying truthers are, consciously or unconsciously, insincere? And they, at their deepest level, don't believe their BS and would acknowledge it is BS if they were honest?

I would agree that they live in a fantasy world and mistake this self-created world for reality. Why they do so cannot be so easily answered, however.

This is absolutely wrong. Truthers that are left are absolutely committed to this idea. As I have said elsewhere, they genuinely seem to believe that scientists and engineers agree with them and that 'resistance' to this comes from secret government agencies connected to corporations or something --- or something and this is where it gets murky and confusing, but that doesn't stop them...and why should it?

 

[Scott Sommers]

Traitors, is what they are.

Absolutely.

 

[Walter Ego]

If I read the post correctly, it is not really about the events of September 11, 2001. It is not related to who did or did not attack the WTC buildings and other targets. It is about what kind of people Truthers are..

Correct. The question was whether truthers are conscious jihad apologists regarding the 9/11 attacks. I was not referencing other terrorist attacks.

There are Jihadists. They exist in the Middle East and elsewhere. They are involved in attacks on cafes, military bases, and anonymous civilians in Israel, Iraq, and other places.

Agreed.

The question address whether or not Truthers are apologists for these people. Many Truthers believe that the so-called 911 inside job-thing did not happen but that numerous Muslims do kill people, including civilians, because they are being forced to fight against a faceless entity called the New World Order. So while they are like Truthers in combating the NWO, the Jihadists did not attack the WTC buildings. In fact, they are only involved in fighting and killing because they are resisting the NWO expansion - or something like that. Truthers make numerous statements to this effect, they regularly state they are the real patriots of the USA, and they communicate regularly with entities that broadcast anti-American communications.

I was limiting myself to 9/11 but I would be happy to read any sourced quotes you wish to provide.

In fact, I will take this further. If you want the best examples, go to Facebook Truther accounts and ask them. They will answer your questions directly about this. I do not mean Dick Gage (although he has a Facebook account). If you want better Truthers to talk to about this, I will give you their names. But they will not hide these facts from you. They seem to feel proud of this. after all, they (and Ron Paul) are real patriots fighting for an American way of life.

No thanks. I prefer my truthers at a slight remove.

 

[Justin39640]

Can you post some of them? Is their intention to let the terrorists off the hook?

An apologist is a person who argues to defend or justify some policy or institution. In which case truthers must believe terrorists did attack the U.S. on 9/11 and are trying to justify such an attack.

But this is precisely, if they are being honest, what they don't believe.

I think you're giving them too much credit. Most seem incapable of looking more than one step into something let alone thinking of what their beliefs imply (like it or not).

So in a way they are apologists even though most are just way too stupid to realize it.

 

[Walter Ego]

Traitors, is what they are.

Are you saying truthers are traitors in the legal sense or a more general sense of that of the word.

Oran's Dictionary of the Law (1983) defines treason as "...[a]...citizen's actions to help a foreign government overthrow, make war against, or seriously injure the [parent nation]."

This would mean truthers are consciously and willfully aiding terrorists. Can your give an example? Keep in mind truthers do not believe we were attacked by terrorists on 9/11, or if we were, the "terrorists" were either agents or "dupes" of our own government.

If you mean that truthers are traitors in the way democrats and progressives are pronounced as "traitors" daily on Fox News or in the right-media you have no case.

 

[Scott Sommers]

Once agin, this all goes back to what we mean by doing something "consciously". The man who believes that "yes really means no" doesn't think he is a rapist, but he is conscious and motivated toward the goal of rape.

Infowars is full of this stuff
Terrorist Who Trained London Bombers Was Working For US Government

I have a quote from one of my Facebook buddies,

...stuck between a rock and a hard place we are dealing with the reality of the new world order which is using muslims as scapegoats in false flag attacks upon us to instill fear in the people, while at the same time having to remember that it is a blood thirsty "religion" based on conquering the world by the sword. it is my belief that t...he whole "ground zero mosque" controversy, just like 911, is NWO tactic to manipulate and control the masses.

A different Truther posted a link to something entitled this

Gordon Brown says Saddam Hussein was in the way of the New World Order

There's this

Article sourced from the highly biased, Debka.com; so, feel free to soften your own interpretation of the Al Qaida, "western-hating terrorists" language to something which better comports with the reality of Al See-eye-aida.

On their websites they post links like this
http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/02/pentagons-secret-killers-get-a-new-leader/

Is this what you mean?

 

[Walter Ego]

I think you're giving them too much credit. Most seem incapable of looking more than one step into something let alone thinking of what their beliefs imply (like it or not).

So in a way they are apologists even though most are just way too stupid to realize it.

That's what I said in the OP. Jihad apology is the effect of trutherism, not its underlying cause.

To believe otherwise is to believe truthers are in complete agreement with the jihadist world view and are working, covertly or overtly, to support it . In which case they would be saying, yes, we were attacked on 9/11 by terrorists and we deserved to be attacked because of our policies and actions in the Muslim world.

 

[Scott Sommers]

To believe otherwise is to believe truthers are in complete agreement with the jihadist world view and are working, covertly or overtly, to support it.

They don't have to be in complete agreement. I agree with some of the goals perused by the Black Panthers in the 1960s, but not all of them.

In which case they would be saying, yes, we were attacked on 9/11 by terrorists and we deserved to be attacked because of our policies and actions in the Muslim world.

Or they could be saying that we are under attack by the same secret world government and even though Muslims didn't do it, it is understandable that they do other violent things.

 

[Justin39640]

That's what I said in the OP. Jihad apology is the effect of trutherism, not its underlying cause.

I know, I just wanted to point out that it was out of complete stupidity lol.

I'm still waiting for AJ, Gage, etc to issue their formal apologies to OBL, AQ, and the families of the 19 men wrongfully accused of this heinous crime. Also that they are working diligently to reverse this injustice. Not to mention the "Free Zacarias Mousai" campaign.

Stupid truthers...