Advice on running a lab

[TruthSeeker]

Can anyone suggest a good resource on setting up and running a lab? Something with advice regarding management of personnel, resources, funding ...that sort of thing.

I've been feeling a bit overwhelmed

Thanks
TS

 

[Rolfe]

Well, I've run labs, but not had to do much setting up from scratch. We did move to new premises last year though, which was fun.

I think it depends on what the lab is going to do. What assays are to be performed, for what purposes? How big is your budget? Do you already have premises, or what is envisaged for that? Starting with an already-benched room is different from starting with a grassy field.

Rolfe.

 

[drkitten]

Starting with an already-benched room is different from starting with a grassy field.

[obligatory math joke] Not really. Just rip out the already benched room, plant grass, and reduce the problem to a previously solved case.
[/obligatory math joke]

 

[TruthSeeker]

Well, I've gotten funding to pay for renovations and equipment. I'm in meetings now with the "space" people to determine how my former hospital rooms will turn into a lab.

I have two staff, three grad students, a postdoc and one undergrad. Paying sufficient attention to each of them is difficult and I am under pressure to increase the size. We have weekly lab meeting where each presents an update on their project but my postdoc also needs (her insistence) weekly one-on-one meetings and I meet with the others one on one as needed.

I have several grants but know nothing about book-keeping. the hospital sends me monthly statements but I don't really understand them. I need to get more money as one of my grants is in its final year. Right now, we get about 250k Canadian/year for operating expenses from the grants. We are self-financing..in other words, all our money comes from grants.

On top of this is pressure to publish and teach etc etc and I'm beginning to feel very overwhelmed.

Venting feels good though. Thanks

 

[Rolfe]

[obligatory math joke] Not really. Just rip out the already benched room, plant grass, and reduce the problem to a previously solved case.
[/obligatory math joke]

Which rather turns this back to "what is your budget...."

Rolfe.

 

[Rolfe]

On top of this is pressure to publish and teach etc etc and I'm beginning to feel very overwhelmed.

This sounds like a very familiar problem. In fact you need a good manager, but there probably isn't a budget for a good manager.

You need to find someone in a more senior academic post who has been through all this and is sympathetic. And who is willing to talk you through the pitfalls. Maybe there is indeed some such paragon in the forum. At the very worst, what is your product going to be? Who is going to expect you to deliver what? Figure that one out and put it to the top of the priority list.

Me, I'm just about to think of something else nice to say to my manager, who is one of the pearls of creation.

Rolfe.

 

[pgwenthold]

Can anyone suggest a good resource on setting up and running a lab? Something with advice regarding management of personnel, resources, funding ...that sort of thing.

I've been feeling a bit overwhelmed

Thanks
TS

Step 1: do what you need to do, bare bones, to start getting results. Getting things working is more importantly than having them work optimally. It will not be as cost effective at the beginning, but results will lead to additional funding (and it sounds like you have enough).

In remodeling, how tight is the budget? Do you have to come in under a given figure or just as low as possible? Always an important concern in planning.

In terms of managing the budget for supplies and whatnot, I tell my group that we have 4 categories of costs:

1) Can't live without - these are things without which you can't do anything. When they are needed, you must get them
2) Need to do our work - these are things that we need to do the specific work we want to do (as opposed those above which just make us operational but not doing anything useful)
3) Things we want - things that make doing our work a lot easier, although we can make do without them.
4) Things we could use - more luxurious items

We usually run somewhere between 2 and 3, with 2 being given and 3 upon special request. In times of good funding, we can basically run at cost level 3. At the end of the funding cycle when we need to spend, we run at level 4.

Having this type of breakdown relieves you of worrying about management decisions that you don't need to make. If everyone in the group is aware of the current spending level, they just need to assess where their purchase fits on the list.

As I get older, I am placing more and more trust in my group to keep things working. They have a stake in it all, and they will take it seriously. It helps to have good senior students around who know what's going on and how I like things done.

 

[TillEulenspiegel]

At the risk of nepotism.........Go here:
Lab Safety Corporation

1245 Rand Road

Des Plaines, IL 60016

Contacts: Margh McKeon and Greg Peters

Ph. 715-822-4795
Fax. 847-699-7040

Tell em Till sent ya.

 

[Tez]

The way my grants work, I pay a considerable overhead to the university (40%-103% depending on the source of the money). This money employs the adminstrators/human resources people/facilities managers etc. and I tell them broadly what I want and they do it. (Well, most times....) So basically I'd start looking around to see if there's someone you can delegate that stuff to!

I dont think its unreasonable for your grad students to meet with you 1 on 1 every week (at a minimum). As for the postdoc - well, I dont see the need for it per se. In fact a good postdoc should be able to take on a supervisory role for the grad students while you get settled. In fact I'd call her/him in, say that that is what you expect of them for the next few months, and that you'll make sure to write a good letter of recommendation emphasising their leadership skills if they do so satisfactorily...

 

[TruthSeeker]

Thanks for the advice.

I called the finance people. I have an appointment set up where someone will explain the monthly statements to me and show me how to do the bits I need to do.

I think a big part of my "overwhelm" is because my supervisor wasn't really much of a supervisor. He was a big star heading to retirement (I was his last student) so basically he was uninvolved in my thesis. We did not have lab meetings and I think I met with him less than once each quarter. I still doubt that he's read my thesis. Regardless of what I gave him to read, his response was always "it's fabulous. Don't change a word!" I used to fantasize about asking him to read suicide notes or death threats just to see how he'd respond

Shortly after I graduated, I took up with my ex who is a leader in the field and offered some mentorship but he's gone from my life now.

Anyway, the end result is that I come to this whole PI thing unprepared and feeling like I have to play catchup. [eta: I did get some good news today. An editor actually wrote:" You have written a beautiful and scholarly paper" WOW!!!]

So, I am thankful for your advice and for the opportunity to vent.

 

[pgwenthold]

Anyway, the end result is that I come to this whole PI thing unprepared and feeling like I have to play catchup.

Can I tell you something that might make you feel better?

Everyone feels this way.

You were trained to be a scientist. Somewhere along the way, they may have even given you a little teaching in how to think about proposals. But first and foremost, you are a scientist.

All of a sudden, you have to be a full-time manager.

Nothing you have ever done has prepared you for this, but now it is your main job. You didn't have anyone to "groom" you for this position like they do in industry. They just throw you in water for the first time and expect you to swim the english channel.

Work hard, get results. And I agree with Tez, your post-doc needs to take on a leadership role, especially scientifically. Post-docs should be far more scientifically independent than grad students.


Since you didn't have a lot of experience in this area, I will give yo the following advice: Get your students writing papers, with the help of the post-doc. The post-doc handles the initial drafts and when he is satisfied, that's when it goes to your desk. It is a great burden relief for you (keeps you writing proposals) and is excellent training for the post-doc.

 

[LW]

Can anyone suggest a good resource on setting up and running a lab?

No, but I can give you this hint: when the mixture turns green and starts to bubble vigorously, it is the time to run from the lab.

 

[Capsid]

Can anyone suggest a good resource on setting up and running a lab? Something with advice regarding management of personnel, resources, funding ...that sort of thing.

I've been feeling a bit overwhelmed

Thanks
TS

You could try this book

It very much depends on what is the lab's function as this pretty much dictates its design. Safety is aways a paramount consideration. Do you handle pathogens, GMOs, is containment necessary, air handling? Do you want the students to be sat in the lab or have their own office space? Waste disposal, sinks, handbasins? Budget?

Early consultation/discussion with the lab staff would also be helpful as this will iron out any issues of the practicalities of the design as well as giving a sense of involvement which is one step towards good interpersonal and managerial skills.

I have been involved in setting labs and currently designing a cat 3 suite and associated supporting labs/offices. I'd be happy to help if you need advice.

 

[TruthSeeker]

Thanks so much for the wonderful advice and the book suggestion.

Our lab will be a combo of wet and dry space...students will work there and there will be some patient assessments but also we will spin and freeze blood etc. Pricing biosafety cabinets is what brought on yesterday's panic.

pg, thanks for normalizing my angst. It is true: I feel so completely unprepared for all of this. I wish they did teach some of these skills in grad school

As for the postdoc, I will try to get her to take on a greater leadership role. Honestly, I doubt if she can.

That's the other thing I need to learn: how to pick good students

 

[pgwenthold]

That's the other thing I need to learn: how to pick good students

If you have the luxury of being able to do so, that is a good thing to be able to do. I, however, cannot afford to be that selective.