Acupuncture

[Kaylee]

I spent 90 minutes earlier today listening to a doctor from a large medical center in NYC that also does research in hearing loss give an intro/overview on gene therapy for the inner ear. Overall I liked the presentation until someone asked the last question for the evening:
"Is there a place for acupuncture therapy along with cochlear implants?" *

The answer -- "Yes." Perhaps he saw some jaws drop because he then added after a very long pause, "I don't advocate it but there is a role for acupuncture therapy."

I dropped the ball. I should have jumped up and said, "But why is there a place for acupuncture, when most double blinded studies on it show nothing better than a placebo effect?"

But I didn't. Partially it was because I had to make sure to grab some people and talk to them before they left. Partially because I would have had to wait for the audience mic to be passed to me. But it was also because I was stunned. I really admire that medical center. It has a great rep. I personally know two people who got cochlear implants there who are doing just fantastic. OK, anecdotal evidence, but it means a heck of a lot to me. One of the best otoneurologists I know is affiliated with that center and through acquaintances I know that there are other excellent doctors affiliated with that center also.

Maybe the doctor who presented earlier this evening was exhausted from a long day and just wasn't up to educating people about placebo effects -- but what an extremely disappointing answer. I still can't believe he gave it.


*(The Q&A had drifted over to the latest trends in cochlear implants -- which the medical center also handles, and in some ways was of more interest to people in the audience because its available now).

 

[Zelenius]

This isn't all that surprising. Under the banner of "integrative" medicine, quackery like acupuncture, as well as "energy medicine", is slowly infiltrating various hospitals, clinics, and medical schools. It's a disturbing trend.

I think how you reacted was fine, you didn't have to immediately jump up to say acupuncture is just a placebo. Maybe you could have just discussed this with the doctor afterwards.

This post is old, but has this medical center gotten better or worse since then?

 

[Kaylee]

This isn't all that surprising. Under the banner of "integrative" medicine, quackery like acupuncture, as well as "energy medicine", is slowly infiltrating various hospitals, clinics, and medical schools. It's a disturbing trend.

I think how you reacted was fine, you didn't have to immediately jump up to say acupuncture is just a placebo. Maybe you could have just discussed this with the doctor afterwards.

This post is old, but has this medical center gotten better or worse since then?

I can't answer the question. As far as I know, it's still one of the best places to get a cochlear implant in NYC, but I haven't been keeping a close eye on that topic lately.

If "integrative medicine" is a new trend, I agree that is very disturbing. As a person with hearing loss I am especially annoyed by the thought that private and public health insurance money could be made available for "therapies" that have no evidence to support them while money for hearing aids and assistive listening devices (ALDs) are scarce or simply not available at all. Hearing aids (IF well fitted -- and that is another huge topic in its own right) and ALDs are proven technologies that help people stay aware of what is going on in their surroundings (alternative ways to know if one's morning alarm clock or smoke alarm has gone off, or if someone is at your front door, as just a few examples) and connected to people all of which also have proven positive secondary effects on one's mental health and even warding off dementia.

The idea of coverage for acupuncture and other non-proven "therapies" but often no coverage for hearing aids or ALDs in many states and under most insurance policies annoys me to no end.

 

[casebro]

Hmmm,,, Since a major part of ALL therapies is the placebo effect, I suppose those in charge feel that offering Acupuncture might be the cheaper alternative- to things like physical therapy? Lots of medical probs do get better in time, all by themselves. Acupunture may be the cheapest way to while away that time.

 

[Kaylee]

Hmmm,,, Since a major part of ALL therapies is the placebo effect, I suppose those in charge feel that offering Acupuncture might be the cheaper alternative- to things like physical therapy? Lots of medical probs do get better in time, all by themselves. Acupunture may be the cheapest way to while away that time.

Hmm, I think a less expensive option would be to tell people to take some aspirin for a few days.

However, acupuncture is undoubtedly a good way to bill people. I hate to see it compared to physical therapy because physical therapy if directed by a knowledgeable pt and carried out by a cooperative patient can go a long way towards solving serious physical problems, even permanently.

 

[arthwollipot]

"I don't advocate it but there is a role for acupuncture therapy."

I don't see this as too bad an answer, actually. He's saying that he doesn't recommend that people get acupuncture - he doesn't advocate its use - but at the same time he recognises that where patients want it, they should be able to get it. The role for acupuncture may be in "easing patients' concerns about treatment" but it's still a role.

 

[Visual Purple]

Hmmm,,, Since a major part of ALL therapies is the placebo effect, I suppose those in charge feel that offering Acupuncture might be the cheaper alternative- to things like physical therapy? Lots of medical probs do get better in time, all by themselves. Acupunture may be the cheapest way to while away that time.

The placebo effect really only shows up with any consistency for pain and similar subjective symptoms--although I agree that people sometimes lump "getting better anyway" and "telling the doctor what you think s/he wants to hear" into the the same category. This/ article shows the difference between subjective and objective symptoms: a placebo made asthma patients feel better, but their lung function was unimproved, meaning that they remained as much at risk for complications, including death, as ever, but thought they were better. (And this is a study that supposedly showed the power of placebo.

(The mysterious healing power of placebo is my particular ex-woo.)

 

[Kaylee]

I don't see this as too bad an answer, actually. He's saying that he doesn't recommend that people get acupuncture - he doesn't advocate its use - but at the same time he recognises that where patients want it, they should be able to get it. The role for acupuncture may be in "easing patients' concerns about treatment" but it's still a role.

I think most people in the audience interpreted his comments as saving that acupuncture was a legitimate source of medical treatment although he didn't happen to favor it.

If acupuncture truly has no better results than placebo, than I think its a terrible waste of resources and in most cases demonstrates a lack of respect for the patient. It's not just the patient's time and money but also all of that money spent on "training", office space, supplies and furnishings. Imagine if it were being spent on something that could actually make a difference.

 

[zeno2712]

You may be interested in our latest win against the Royal London Hospital for Integrated Medicine for claims made in two leaflets on acupuncture: The Nightingale Collaboration: Getting the point