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A bible in every Texas classroom

TsarBomba

One Damn Dirty Ape
TsarBomba
Joined
Jan 7, 2007
Messages
808
The head of the appropriations committee in the Texas House has proposed HB-1287, which would require all 1,700 Texas high schools to offer two elective classes on the Bible as literature--with the sole textbook being the Holy Bible.

You can hear a representative of the Texas Freedom Network interviewed about this program on this week's Dogma Free America.

You can see the TFN press release here.

TFN also has a fascinating report on the problems with the elective Bible classes that are currently tought in Texas.
 
richorman said:
The head of the appropriations committee in the Texas House has proposed HB-1287, which would require all 1,700 Texas high schools to offer two elective classes on the Bible as literature--with the sole textbook being the Holy Bible.

You can hear a representative of the Texas Freedom Network interviewed about this program on this week's Dogma Free America.

You can see the TFN press release here.

TFN also has a fascinating report on the problems with the elective Bible classes that are currently tought in Texas.
Click to expand...

That's just horendous. Now I am not oppose per se to teaching bible as lit etc. ( I think it would be hard to find someone qualified to teach it secularly who would want to). but there are so many good books out there that should be used in addition to the bible. You really cannot just jump in with the bible like that. At the very least if you are going to look at the Bible as lit, you need some contextualizing books.

I can tell you that people who take this class will probably be at a less advantageous position than others if they actually choose to go onto study religion as lit/history/anthropologically. Because they will have this one image of the bible and be without the more accepted works of scholars.
 
richorman said:
The head of the appropriations committee in the Texas House has proposed HB-1287, which would require all 1,700 Texas high schools to offer two elective classes on the Bible as literature--with the sole textbook being the Holy Bible.

You can hear a representative of the Texas Freedom Network interviewed about this program on this week's Dogma Free America.

You can see the TFN press release here.

TFN also has a fascinating report on the problems with the elective Bible classes that are currently tought in Texas.
Click to expand...

:D :rolleyes: :rolleyes: I'm fine with it as long as it is truly elective and the person with the best grade each quarter is crucified for the sins of the rest!
 
DOC said:
The Bible is the best selling book of all time -- it only makes sense to study it -- as literature, as philosophy, as history, or simply because it is the best selling book of all time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_books
Click to expand...

Yes, but people who really study Shakespeare don't just sit and read his works, they read commentaries and such.

To read the bible, but ignore say Pelican or Mendenhall or any other is an issue.


Also the more I think about it, didn't the suppreme court state that having the representative images or such of somthing of one religion in a school was an issue because it implicitly supported the religion in a way? (been a while since I studied it so I can no longer site the case.)
 
richorman said:
The head of the appropriations committee in the Texas House has proposed HB-1287, which would require all 1,700 Texas high schools to offer two elective classes on the Bible as literature--with the sole textbook being the Holy Bible.

You can hear a representative of the Texas Freedom Network interviewed about this program on this week's Dogma Free America.

You can see the TFN press release here.

TFN also has a fascinating report on the problems with the elective Bible classes that are currently tought in Texas.
Click to expand...


So are they holding elective classes on the Quran and the Torah, too?
 
They couldn't force it into science classes so now they want to sneak it into Lit. What's next, Phys Ed? When will it end?


DOC said:
The Bible is the best selling book of all time -- it only makes sense to study it -- as literature, as philosophy, as history, or simply because it is the best selling book of all time.
Click to expand...


The bible is not a best seller on its literary merits, unless rambling, disjointed and contradictory are what we look for in a good read. Jacqueline Suzanne novels make more sense (I'm assuming) and were best sellers, but you wouldn't expect them to be studied in high school.
 
I agree that educated people should have a general idea of what is contained in the Bible, but there are very serious problems with these classes. As the Texas Freedom Network report shows, the so-called non-religious bible-as-literature classes that are currently taught in over 20 Texas high schools have been caught teaching zingers such as:

--humans and dinosaurs walked the Earth together (sound familiar?)

--the story of Adam and Even in genesis shows that women are relegated to an inferior status in society.

--Christianity "completes" or "supplements" Judaism.

Also, many of the existing classes are taught by pastors from local churches! No joke! Pastors from local churches teaching high school bible-as-literature classes!

In addition, this bill mandates that every single high school in Texas offer these "elective" bible classes, but provides no funding (i.e. it is an unfunded mandate) and provides no standards for how the classes are taught (other than the Bible is to be the primary text used) and no standards regarding teacher qualifications.

Lastly, I respectfully disagree with those who posted replies stating that there is no problem with these classes as long as they are voluntary. The American public education system is rightly criticized for failing to educate kids in math, science, history, English, and geography. Now this idiot in Texas (who has A LOT OF POWER in the legislature) wants to waste school time and resources teaching a mythological view of the world for two whole semesters.

One last aside. The idiot who is proposing this bill earlier this year sent a letter to each and every other member of the Texas legislature saying that the theory of evolution was a Jewish plot. I am not kidding.
 
I'd have no objection to a secular scholarly Bible class being taught, but I sort of doubt that that's what these guys have in mind. For example, you could tell the kids that the messianic prophecies in Isaiah were not originally messianic, that the young mother was not a virgin until Greek mysticism influenced Judaism, and that the Jesus birth story was fabricated to fit the supposed prophecy.
 
DOC said:
The Bible is the best selling book of all time -- it only makes sense to study it -- as literature, as philosophy, as history, or simply because it is the best selling book of all time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_books
Click to expand...

It makes sense to study it as history? A book that describes a world-wide flood is not an accurate history book. A book with talking animals is not a good history book.

As for being the best selling book of all time, I'd like to point out:
1) popularity ≠ accuracy.
2) in addition to being the best-selling book, it might also be the least-read book of all time. I will never ceased to be amazed by the number of Christians who have no idea what is in that book.
 
Ladewig said:
It makes sense to study it as history? A book that describes a world-wide flood is not an accurate history book. A book with talking animals is not a good history book.

As for being the best selling book of all time, I'd like to point out:
1) popularity ≠ accuracy.
2) in addition to being the best-selling book, it might also be the least-read book of all time. I will never ceased to be amazed by the number of Christians who have no idea what is in that book.
Click to expand...

Additionally, there might be some skewing going on. Most families could reasonably have more than one copy of the bible, but who needs more than one watership down. Also I don't think hotels often keep Harry Potter books in their dressers (would be much cooler than the bible though).

Also, I have 1 copy of probably 70 percent of the books on their. Off the top of my head I count more than 10 bibles in my possesion.
 
ChristineR said:
I'd have no objection to a secular scholarly Bible class being taught, but I sort of doubt that that's what these guys have in mind.
Click to expand...

Actually Ryan Valentine from the Texas Freedom Network makes a good point in his interview on the Dogma Free America podcast. He thinks that the proponents of this bill really don't care whether it passes or not--i.e. that it is in reality not about having these bible classes at all, but is a wedge issue for the 2008 elections. No one is going to want to vote against this thing, for fear of a mailer in every voter's mailbox with a picture of the Bible with the word "banned" stamped across it in big red letters.
 
Nice to see attention is paid to what is REALLY important in an education in Texas. Forget Art, Music, culture; all they need is a poorly - written collection of plagurized fairytales as a giudeline for their future generation.

I weep for humanity.
 
Katana said:
So are they holding elective classes on the Quran and the Torah, too?
Click to expand...

Actually, to be fair, it would include the Torah, which is the first five books of the "Old Testament" (or as Jews would call it, "The Bible"). The first class would be "The Old Testament as Literature." This would be a semester-long class. The second class would be . . . you guessed it . . . "The New Testament as Literature."

My guess is that the "Old Testament" class would concentrate on Genesis (part of the Torah) , Exodus (part of the Torah), Psalms, Chronicles, Job, and the like.
 
DOC said:
The Bible is the best selling book of all time -- it only makes sense to study it -- as literature, as philosophy, as history, or simply because it is the best selling book of all time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_books
Click to expand...


no, it doesnt make any sense to study it because its popular. that makes no sense at all. You are appealing to popularity, and its a logical fallacy. Popular hardly means correct, or even valuable. thats like saying the back street boys sold a lot of albums so music classes should study them.
 
richorman said:
Actually, to be fair, it would include the Torah, which is the first five books of the "Old Testament" (or as Jews would call it, "The Bible"). The first class would be "The Old Testament as Literature." This would be a semester-long class. The second class would be . . . you guessed it . . . "The New Testament as Literature."

My guess is that the "Old Testament" class would concentrate on Genesis (part of the Torah) , Exodus (part of the Torah), Psalms, Chronicles, Job, and the like.
Click to expand...

Don't forget Isaiah. Christians love Isaiah for some reason.




(I understand why, its just so anachronistic that it bothers me a lot)
 
Man I just went back to the wiki list of books to search for somthing else, and then I noticed the date on the bible.

WTHeck? There is no way 3000 BCE is in any way an accurate date.
That is really one of the most egregious errors I have yet seen on Wiki.
That's talking about a period where Egypt just barely had any writing.
 
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