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5G Mobile Technology

MattNelson

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Messages
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I've created a YouTube playlist with both mainstream and conspiracy videos here: 5G Must Be Stopped. But this thread isn't meant to argue about why or if it should be stopped. I think this will be inherent during a cursory overview, and that 5G will fail [in the U.S., at least at the scale it's envisioned achieving by technocrats] after people's awareness reaches critical mass. I mean to educate and open discussion on people's experiences with the new technology.

The topic of health issues and EMF is to be discussed elsewhere:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=336468
Yet the thread phrased it as a question ("Is 5G Technology Really A Health Risk?"), with the OP introducing the issue using a conspiracy-minded video link (same as #3 of my playlist) that includes dross about chemtrails.... To save you some time, I've compiled some links regarding the proven health issues, scientific studies, and related activism here:

https://www.5gspaceappeal.org/
https://scientists4wiredtech.com/
https://www.saferemr.com/2018/11/NTP-final-reports31.html
https://microwavenews.com/news-center/ntp-final-rf-report
https://ethics.harvard.edu/files/center-for-ethics/files/capturedagency_alster.pdf
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Martin_Pall
https://ehtrust.org/
https://ia802302.us.archive.org/28/items/emfs_training_workbook/emfs_training_workbook.pdf
https://bioinitiative.org/
https://www.cellphonetaskforce.org/5g-from-blankets-to-bullets/
https://www.americansforresponsibletech.org/scientific-studies
https://ntp.niehs.nih.gov/results/areas/cellphones/
https://emfscientist.org/index.php/emf-scientist-appeal
https://ehtrust.org/wp-content/uploads/Suozzi-Letter-to-FCC-re-Health-Concerns-4.16.19.pdf
https://www.kdrv.com/content/news/School-wireless-safety-bill-passes-state-senate-511283802.html
https://legiscan.com/LA/text/HR145/...gRmb-dvXSZNDFg9H9yH7SbajTZeAmTd-ErYdirW6nba_0
http://assembly.coe.int/nw/xml/XRef...LyY7W1HdpX3XkTMFDSjsvRBwg21GfYAmLYCNK3_3AymSo
https://www.ntd.com/doctors-call-for-delaying-deployment-of-5g-due-to-health-risks_339335.html
https://www.vcstar.com/story/news/l...s-dianne-feinstein-julia-brownley/1224775001/
https://www.govtech.com/network/San-Diego-to-Review-5G-Antenna-Rules-After-Resident-Backlash.html
https://www.thedenverchannel.com/ne...nts-about-placement-of-cell-towers-on-schools
https://www.koin.com/news/civic-affairs/5g-cell-tower-critics-post-health-warning-signs/
https://www.latimes.com/socal/daily-pilot/news/tn-dpt-me-lb-council-5g-20190510-story.html
https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/anti-tech_swiss-5g-debate-heats-up-with-protest-in-bern/44956038
https://m.timesunion.com/news/article/Grondahl-5G-cell-protests-span-from-Albany-to-13843495.php
https://www.kdrv.com/content/news/Group-rallies-against-new-5G-technology-roll-out-510001741.html
https://wlos.com/news/local/local-g...s-part-of-national-protest-over-5g-technology
https://www.longislandpress.com/2019/05/16/long-islanders-join-nationwide-anti-5g-rally
http://www.thebrillionnews.com/2019/05/20/group-questions-safety-of-5g-wireless/
https://www.gq.com/story/warning-cell-phone-radiation
https://www.facebook.com/babysafeproject
https://principia-scientific.org/petition-26000-scientists-oppose-5g-roll-out


How does 5G work?

5G stands for 5th generation. Previous generations of cell service work from towers that provide coverage of about 10 miles (video link), up to 22-45 miles across land. 5G needs line of sight with its range of ~300 meters, or less than 1,000 feet between relay antennae. These will be installed in a variety of setups, including devices on streetlamps, utility poles, corners of buildings (as seen here in NYC), and small cell towers on poles erected where no such configuration is possible. The WIFI boxes will need to be installed inside also, since the millimeter waves don't travel through buildings.

http://www.911conspiracy.tv/images/5g_small_cell_examples.jpg
- as seen at https://www.5gcrisis.com/identify (not hotlinked)

A common mistake is saying 5G means 5 Gigahertz. Numerous frequencies are being used for 5G. There is low, mid, and high band, which engineer Pawel Wypychowski divides into 2 categories, low being less than 7 GHz, and high, which is 24 - 71 GHz. See a screenshot from his slide at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrBiLbhvZCs#t=10m25s

http://www.911conspiracy.tv/images/5G_band_spectrum_frequency_range_by_country_Pawel Wypychowski.png

FYI, see video explaining MIMO, "Everything You Need to Know About 5G": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEx_d0SjvS0&t=2m51s

Seen at 26:30 in the Pawel Wypychowski video, after hearing that about 80% of traffic will be for 4K/8K video, we see the projected sales figures:

http://www.911conspiracy.tv/images/5g_radio_shipments_sales_by_units_graph.jpg

That amounts to more than 700 million devices installed around the planet. Consider insect and bird population reduction, exacerbated by the required tree-cutting. Misinformation unfortunately taints truth about the tree cutting when "conspiracy theorists" point to the wrong examples. See https://www.metabunk.org/debunked-t...-block-5g-tree-replacement-in-belgium.t10506/ There are many relevant examples of tree cutting. If you speak Italian, see the video "5G: The Massacre of Trees" linked in the luogocomune.net article https://www.luogocomune.net/LC/23-energia-e-ambiente/5269-5g-la-strage-degli-alberi at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17pohG0Z0Q0 (grain of salt...)
See also a Facebook video from Ann Marie Carey in England: https://www.facebook.com/annmumcarey/videos/10161627169095710/ and a Florida-area story at https://tallahasseereports.com/2017/12/12/new-5g-technology-threatens-canopy-roads/ Additionally, UK planning documents about 5G infrastructure specifically address the issue: https://assets.publishing.service.g...rt__5g-planning-geospatial-considerations.pdf The signal doesn't go into buildings, except somewhat through windows, which is why the WIFI units from Samsung are sometimes stuck there.

Wireless Node
A cell site in your neighborhood creates a 5G signal, which is transmitted wirelessly to your home.
Receiver
This receives the 5G signal, and relays it to a router inside your home. It's usually placed on or near a window.
Router
This creates a Wi-Fi network from the 5G signal. It's powered by 5G wirelessly, instead of with cables. If needed, we'll add free Wi-Fi extenders for extra coverage.
Click to expand...
- https://www.verizonwireless.com/5g/home/

While not billed as 5G, the SpaceX Starlink system of satellites (nearly 12,000) will use high "V-band" and "Ka-band" for their internet broadband system. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starlink_(satellite_constellation) and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giQ8xEWjnBs Find the Starlink thread here: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=337070 Speaking of satellites and 5G, but not necessarily Starlink, Bloomberg points out that NOAA is afraid that 5G may interfere with storm prediction: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/vide...nology-could-disrupt-hurricane-trackers-video "5G Technology Could Disrupt Hurricane Trackers."

Speeds about 10x faster than 4G (around 1 Gbps depending on location) can be attained if you are in the limited coverage area (and if it's not raining or you're inside next to your 5G WIFI). Low latency is the big seller for financial transactions (especially for Starlink), self-driving cars and networked robotics. 4G has about 45 millisecond response time; 5G, about 1 ms (Says CNBC at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DG3pMcNNlw#t=55s ) "Remote medical procedures" are becoming reality through robotics, virtual reality (VR), and 5G. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lu9G7ef9uBg#t=1m37s from the Wall Street Journal.

Really, 5G isn't for cell phones. But people will buy them anyway, despite the fact that the phones get too hot and automatically switch back to 4G. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahsvlm4Mb7E#t=1m42s ) The automotive industry has invested hundreds of millions of dollars in the tech. (link) Uber is banking on it. The Internet of Things also relies on 5G becoming a reality.

All the data generated by networked sensors promises a world where privacy is no longer an issue. Your location doesn't need to be triangulated by authorities if you have a 5G phone, so if an IoT sensor is triggered when you have been documented in the same location with your phone at that time, you may be targeted for questioning by law enforcement... and any related data may be sold to the highest bidder. (See video at 15:00: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXbvL0uZkrY#t=14m30s ) So you'll see more ads that have ID'd you and used your recent activity on the web (assuming you're logged into Google/YouTube, Facebook, etc.) to compare with your interactions in the IoT universe. You can unlock your front door, start a blender, turn off lights, etcetera -- with your phone. So, then, can others. Just like people have hacked into networked baby monitors and webcams... which is why you should cover the cameras on your devices with tape (like Zuckerburg). The phone is always listening for you to say "Hey Google." What else is it listening for? One investigation confirms: everything -- to advertise, at least: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBnDWSvaQ1I

Where Is 5G in the U.S.?

Only T-Mobile has a coverage map so far:
https://www.t-mobile.com/coverage/our-first-5g-coverage-maps
While speedtest.net is compiling its own map: https://www.speedtest.net/ookla-5g-map I've compiled a list of cities currently served (in part):

Verizon:
Chicago, Houston, Indianapolis, Sacramento, and Minneapolis, select areas of Denver, and starting July 1st: Providence, RI. Also "parts" of seven more cities: Austin, Los Angeles, Nashville, Orlando, San Diego, San Francisco, and San Jose. Verizon plans to launch the following cities in 2019:
Atlanta, Boston, Charlotte, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Columbus, Dallas, Des Moines, Detroit, Kansas City, Little Rock, Memphis, Phoenix, Salt Lake City, Washington, D.C.
(sources: https://www.verizonwireless.com/5g/ and https://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/verizon-5g-rollout/ ) Coverage will be spotty for some time. (Sacramento complains: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oyn1b9BjK_c )

AT&T:
Atlanta, Charlotte, Raleigh, Dallas, Houston, Indianapolis, Jacksonville, Louisville, Oklahoma City, New Orleans, San Antonio and Waco, Texas -- recently added are: Austin, Los Angeles, Nashville, Orlando, San Diego, San Francisco, and San Jose
(source: https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech...t-seven-new-cities-total-rises-19/3409787002/ )

Sprint:
Chicago, Atlanta, Dallas-Fort Worth, Houston, and Kansas City. Coming soon in New York, Washington D.C., Los Angeles, Phoenix....
(source: https://www.sprint.com/en/landings/5g.html )

T-Mobile:
June 28, just launched in parts of Cleveland, Atlanta, Dallas, Las Vegas, Los Angeles and New York. T-Mobile may merge with Sprint, FYI.
(sources: https://www.cleveland19.com/2019/06...lc_7kcyo8nYKtWgnipBEmdJ-ghh-FgOZ3ap148iOJvphY and https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech...t-seven-new-cities-total-rises-19/3409787002/ )
 
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Another related thread, about the Manhattan blackout yesterday:
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=337562

Where I posted, quote:

Possibly related, as the cause of the blackout is unknown.

Mayor Bill de Blasio, who was returning to the city after a presidential campaign stop in Iowa, said it appears the outage was the result of a mechanical problem in the electrical grid.
"This appears to be something that just went wrong in the way that they transmit power from one part of the city to another," he told CNN. "It sounds like it is addressable in a reasonable amount of time."
ConEd CEO John McAvoy said the company is working to understand the cause of the outage and needs to do a full engineering analysis.
Click to expand...
- https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/13/us/ne...ges/index.html

5G antennae are being erected on street corners in NYC as we speak. This is a huge load being added to the system... sorry no data. But am I wrong? I mention this because I just watched a video where Dr. Jack Kruse spoke of 5G testing in 2018 causing problems with the power grid. There were issues with jump conductance, apparently. See video at 19:00 -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-kt3_oQ8ns#t=18m47s

A shot of a NYC street corner 5G installation can be seen in this video after the 1:07 mark: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahsvlm4Mb7E#t=1m7s
 
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abaddon said:
What a load of superstitious baloney.
Click to expand...
This. Ignorant, Luddite nonsense, even pathetically trying to drag in the NY blackout.
:rolleyes:
Clearly the author has no understanding of electronics, electromagnetics or even basic physics.

Just look at his attempt to link the deployment of 5G network gear to the NY power outage claiming it constitutes "a huge load being added to the system". Not only is this utter rubbish, 5G is highly power efficient and a tiny load, but the NY grid wasn't near capacity load when the W49 substation failed.

Utter drivel.
 
Not holding my breath; I don’t have a decent 4G signal where I live from my provider, despite it being in a reasonably large town. No doubt they’ll have 5G in London before I get that fixed.
 
zooterkin said:
Not holding my breath; I don’t have a decent 4G signal where I live from my provider, despite it being in a reasonably large town. No doubt they’ll have 5G in London before I get that fixed.
Click to expand...

Actually, the replaced 4G equipment in areas that matter will likely be re-purposed for older areas, so you might get lucky and get decent 4G at last!

:D
 
Hellbound said:
Actually, the replaced 4G equipment in areas that matter will likely be re-purposed for older areas, so you might get lucky and get decent 4G at last!

:D
Click to expand...

Well, that would just support my suggestion, that I won't get decent 4G until London has 5G in place. :(
 
zooterkin said:
Well, that would just support my suggestion, that I won't get decent 4G until London has 5G in place. :(
Click to expand...

And at that point I might get a 3G that works in more than one spot in the house.
:)

timhau said:
For the life of me, I don't understand why people who would like to make a serious argument would make it on a friggin' video.
Click to expand...

That's easy.
They discovered that if they wrote the stuff down then people could easily quote from it and pick it apart piece by piece, but a video requires a larger input of time, is not easy to quote, and so most of us just don't bother. That way the loon can sit there and assume they've "won".
 
Anyone want to explain to me why we want 5G?

I would argue that current connectivity is already at the bandwidth limit of the human ability to absorb.

5G seems to be purely for machine-machine communication. It will be run by A.I. for A.I..
How people benefit from it will be far from obvious.
 
What 5G? Hype free answers please.

Any reader have a 5G handset? One that works on 24GHz, say? How does the core network of a 5G system differ from that of a 4G one? How is the radiation from a 5G handset or base station different from what you’re already exposed to?
 
JeanTate said:
What 5G? Hype free answers please.

Any reader have a 5G handset? One that works on 24GHz, say? How does the core network of a 5G system differ from that of a 4G one? How is the radiation from a 5G handset or base station different from what you’re already exposed to?
Click to expand...

To paraphrase Nigel Tufnel, "These go to five."
 
Apologies for the missing images. If a mod can help clean up the links, one of which is broken due to a missing "%20" code where the space was, it would be appreciated. Please see the "global snapshot of 5G spectrum" to see frequency bands being used across the world.

Then see the "5G and Massive MIMO Radio Shipments" graph giving estimated sales figures over the next 5 years.

The source is this video/slideshow here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrBiLbhvZCs#t=5m29s

Again, this thread isn't for discussion of the many health issues with EMF/RF. I listed about 30 links and pointed to a different thread for that. The world is in denial, much like cigarette smokers in the early days. The telecom companies like it that way, having captured the FCC according to a Harvard Center for Ethics document. Now I'll stop.

This thread is about 5G technology in general, and users' experiences as the new tech is being rolled out across the world. My video playlist, again, is here... mixing mainstream and conspiracy videos. Apologies for the junk about chemtrails.

Like JeanTate, I'm interested in finding people who have a 5G phone. I want to see how often they get too hot and automatically switch back ("kick back" as Digital Trends says) to 4G LTE. (See video about the Samsung S10 5G in New York City.) I'd like to see comparisons in rainy weather, since rain inhibits signal strength.

I thought maybe that's why Seattle and Portland (being "hella" rainy) Oregon aren't getting 5G (yet/maybe), but that's because we (I'm near Portland) joined a long list of cities that have sued FCC to stop it. See https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/201...-FCC-over-5G-cell-network-rule/1911540569147/
 
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JeanTate said:
What 5G? Hype free answers please.

Any reader have a 5G handset? One that works on 24GHz, say? How does the core network of a 5G system differ from that of a 4G one? How is the radiation from a 5G handset or base station different from what you’re already exposed to?
Click to expand...
Yes. I am part of the Digital Docklands project and have used fixed and mobile 5G for nearly a year. I have FWA at home, in a customer site office and in a satellite office, in addition to mobile devices. FWA speed is typically >1Gb/s.

5G's main difference is the use of higher frequencies (shorter wavelengths) than before: >30GHz rather than <6GHz.
This means it can provide far greater bandwidth, but also greater directionality, and that antennae can be much smaller than for previous generations of cellular base stations.
With more, more directional, antennae per base station car more client devices can be supported.
All this means lower energy levels are used, potentially improving battery life for portables.

However high frequencies means shorter range, hence more base stations, but also more redundancy in the mesh. Some of the frequencies used are susceptible to water scattering and absorption.

There are also two other less noticeable changes; smarter bandwidth utilisation and software defined base units. The former means 5G nets are better able to make use of the available RF and prioritise traffic for efficiency. The later means fewer hardware deployments and changes in the future, useful given the number of units.

Hope this helps.
 
The thread was moved to the Conspiracy section. OK. I look forward to seeing a 5G tech thread that isn't in the Conspiracy section.

Mod please note my images were not hotlinked (911conspiracy.tv is mine), so Rule 5 is not applicable. For example, the images of 5G installation examples, "small cell" setups on light poles and utility poles.

Catsmate, thanks for the info. I wanted an intelligent reply about the blackout, since I do not have a background in physics/electronics. (English B.A.) Well served. This is how I need to learn sometimes. What else is factually inaccurate? (On edit: for readers who didn't google Catsmate's "FWA" -- https://5g.co.uk/guides/what-is-5g-fixed-wireless-access-fwa/ )
 
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MattNelson said:
The thread was moved to the Conspiracy section. OK. I look forward to seeing a 5G tech thread that isn't in the Conspiracy section.
Click to expand...
Then start one. Just avoid conspiratorial nonsense this time.

MattNelson said:
Catsmate, thanks for the info. I wanted an intelligent reply about the blackout,
Click to expand...
Then why did you link it, incorrectly and dishonestly, with the 5G deployment?

MattNelson said:
since I do not have a background in physics/electronics. (English B.A.)
Click to expand...
Then I suggest you educate yourself before pontificating on scientific and engineering matters?

MattNelson said:
What else is factually inaccurate?
Click to expand...
Your implication that there is a significant health risk due to 5G cellular services.
This has been investigated by numerous groups and studies, back to the drivel spouted by Curry twenty years ago, and found not to exist.
Instead you continue to propagate the ignorant, unscientific, nonsense of people like Devra Davis, Jerry Philips and Jack Kruse.
 
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