Alert in Israel raised to second highest level

[webfusion]

Over three dozen Qassam and GRAD rockets and at least ten mortar shells were fired from Gaza at southern Israeli towns over the past 60 hours (last report updated Wednesday a.m. Tel Aviv time).
The "lull" (tadiyyeh) has officially expired between Israel and HAMAS.

Convoys of humanitarian aid are unable to get into into Gaza due to the deteriorating security situation --- Israel was trying to arrange the passage of 30 truckloads from the West Bank containing goods supplied by international organizations and another five trucks of cargo from Egyptian Sinai (which had been off-loaded from a Libyan ship docked at el-Arish, that Israel prevented a few weeks ago from sailing directly into Gaza).


Israel's cabinet is due to convene an emergency session later today (Wednesday).
Foreign Minister Livni was scheduled to meet Thursday with Egyptian President Mubarak in Cairo, to discuss the outcome of Egyptian intelligence chief Omar Suleiman's contacts with HAMAS leaders in both Gaza and Damascus. The Egyptians had urged the HAMAS to halt the rockets so as not to give Israel an excuse to invade Gaza.

However, the HAMAS leadership has apparently decided that goading the IDF to invade is now their best course of action, and force the Israelis to re-occupy Gaza (for the third time in the past half-century).

 

[BirdStrike]

"three dozen Qassam and GRAD rockets and at least ten mortar shells were fired from Gaza at southern Israeli towns over the past 60 hours"

If that is not a war I dunno what is.

 

[Darth Rotor]

Over three dozen Qassam and GRAD rockets and at least ten mortar shells were fired from Gaza at southern Israeli towns over the past 60 hours (last report updated Wednesday a.m. Tel Aviv time).

Don't these folks know that New Years Eve is over a week away?

Foreign Minister Livni was scheduled to meet Thursday with Egyptian President Mubarak in Cairo, to discuss the outcome of Egyptian intelligence chief Omar Suleiman's contacts with HAMAS leaders in both Gaza and Damascus. The Egyptians had urged the HAMAS to halt the rockets so as not to give Israel an excuse to invade Gaza.

At least someone's working at it, however disappointing the progress.

However, the HAMAS leadership has apparently decided that goading the IDF to invade is now their best course of action, and force the Israelis to re-occupy Gaza (for the third time in the past half-century).

Web, are you doing a bit of mind reading here?

And if you are right, why would Israeli government order in the IDF, thus taking the bait? Rolling into Gaza is a politically loaded option.

DR

 

[webfusion]

UPDATE -- 2pm

Since 9am (local Tel Aviv time) dozens more rockets and mortars have been raining down on homes, malls, and children's playgrounds, as these Palestinian terrorist gangs are indiscrimately bombing the civilians of the State of Israel.
This extraordinary barrage includes GRAD-Katyusha's that are exploding within Ashkelon city limits.

I know JREF Forums has other threads about the situation in Gaza (one recent topic has gone on for 300 + posts, 8 pages) ----- Sure, this is just "more of the same" in that neck of the woods.

But for a moment, just imagine yourselves under rocket attack in your town or city: What would you demand of your government?

 

[Darth Rotor]

Since 9am (local Tel Aviv time) dozens more rockets and mortars have been raining down on homes, malls, and children's playgrounds, as these Palestinian terrorist gangs are indiscrimately bombing the civilians of the State of Israel.
This extraordinary barrage includes GRAD-Katyusha's that are exploding within Ashkelon city limits.

I know JREF Forums has other threads about the situation in Gaza (one recent topic has gone on for 300 + posts, 8 pages) ----- Sure, this is just "more of the same" in that neck of the woods.

But for a moment, just imagine yourselves under rocket attack in your town or city: What would you demand of your government?

Web, can you link a map or picture of where this is going on? Is there a decent one?

As to what I, a citizen would demand of my government, I suspect the first is "do something to make the rockets stop." I might also ask for them to "get some" in terms of payback. If Mexico, or more likely Mexican criminals and Mexican drug lords, started operating militarily across the Rio Grande, I'd -- oh, wait, the mofos already do. Funny, my government is doing jack s about it. Maybe that's because it's not rocket attacks, but merely murder, kidnapping, and human trafficking.

DR

 

[webfusion]

Don't these folks know that New Years Eve is over a week away?

Not according to the Islamic calendar.

At least someone's working at it, however disappointing the progress.

Well, it would seem to me that an Emergency Session of the United Nations Security Council might be in order ---- of course, that would put quite a dent in the Christmas vacation plans of the various UN representives.

Web, are you doing a bit of mind reading here?

Not really, there have been many published reports indicating that HAMAS & Co. took advantage of the "lull" to build up their forces in Gaza (following the Hezbollah model) and are now ready to put their plans into effect, dragging the IDF into the quagmire.
The attempted breakthrough of the Gaza border yesterday (in which three armed Palestinians were stopped & killed) is evidence of their intentions.

And if you are right, why would Israeli government order in the IDF, thus taking the bait? Rolling into Gaza is a politically loaded option.

The IDF learned valuable lessons in Lebanon, and it may very well be that they have a few new tricks up their sleeves. Preparations for this invasion have been extensive, including a recent training exercise for warfare in built-up areas.

In any case, I am keeping a very close eye on the developments, and really felt the need to open this thread. I do appreciate your tossing in your $0.02 and providing some perspective, D-R.
As always, it is most welcome.

 

[Darth Rotor]

In any case, I am keeping a very close eye on the developments, and really felt the need to open this thread. I do appreciate your tossing in your $0.02 and providing some perspective, D-R.
As always, it is most welcome.

Maybe it's just cynical little me, but if this escalates, the concerns over the blockade/embargo will shrink a bit. For all of the wrong reasons.

I wish I could offer up surprise that the fight continues, but I can't.

DR

 

[BirdStrike]

Web, can you link a map or picture of where this is going on? Is there a decent one?

DR

Here ya go.

Ashkelon is north of Gaza along the coast.

edited to add update:

Palestinian terrorists bombard Ashkelon with Grad rockets

Palestinian terrorists on Wednesday morning fired over 60 rockets and mortar shells from the Gaza Strip at Ashkelon and the western Negev, prompting Israel to hold up a shipment of aid scheduled to pass through to the Strip on Wednesday. Rockets continued to rain on southern Israeli cities throughout the morning hours.

Amazing how Hamas has all this money for rocket fuel, explosives, and materials to wage war.... but none for food.

 

[webfusion]

Thanks, Birdy, I would have liked for a scale of measurement to have been included on that map.

The distances involved are very small. Only a few kilometers.
Israel itself is only about 9 miles wide at the "waist" (Netanya - Tulkarm/West Bank)


Right now, any Israeli response will be depicted in first page headlines as a desecration of Christmas (destroying the season of Peace, an insult to Christianity, and ruining Hope for the Children of the World), and decried as unfair 'collective punishment' of the poor Palestinians... along with other grotesquely cynical clichés.

 

[BirdStrike]

Thanks, Birdy, I would have liked for a scale of measurement to have been included on that map.

My mother is in Ashkelon as I type this post. Visiting my aunt and uncle on a holiday. So far no one is picking up the phone... will keep trying.


edited to add:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/25/world/middleeast/25mideast.html?ref=world

The military wing of Hamas, the Islamic group that controls Gaza, said in a statement that the rocket fire was “a response to Zionist aggression” and to the economic embargo Israel has imposed on Gaza.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1229868837971&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull

Responding to the incessant Kassam fire, Barak announced earlier Wednesday that Israel would hold up a shipment of food and humanitarian supplies that was to be delivered to residents of the Gaza Strip during the day.

...and so the game goes.

 

[webfusion]

It's not a game.

When you do get to talk to your mom, ask her one simple question -- "Does Israel deserve to be under violent attack as retribution for any injustices perpetrated against the Palestinians?"

I would be curious what her answer to that would be.

 

[BirdStrike]

It's not a game.

Definitely.

When you do get to talk to your mom, ask her one simple question -- "Does Israel deserve to be under violent attack as retribution for any injustices perpetrated against the Palestinians?"

I would be curious what her answer to that would be.

Well I look at it this way. Hamas is shelling civilians on purpose, not Israeli military positions. So in my book that is an act of war. My mother is a tourist in Ashkelon, she has no reason to be shelled because of Hamas's jihad with Israel.

 

[webfusion]

Uh, Birdstrike, your mother is visiting a place that is occupied by Zionist settlers.
The only thing that HAMAS is interested in is liberating their land from the Jew usurpers.

See: al-Majdal.

 

[WildCat]

I am shocked, shocked, shocked that the populace which supports 11 political parties founded by terrorists (and just 1 which wasn't) allows this sort of thing to happen!

Surely, peace-loving Palestinians (who make up the overwhelming majority according to some people here) are rioting in the streets demanding an end to this madness... can you link to a story of these riots webfusion?

 

[webfusion]

Sure thing, WildCat, I have my finger on the pulse of public opinion in Gaza.
Glad to provide the details you seek ---

Koran in one hand, Kalish in the other.

 

[quarky]

makes me sad

 

[BirdStrike]

"The increasing stupidity of Israel is forcing us to intensify the rocket fire, and put thousands more Zionists in the line of fire in order to protect the Palestinian people," a spokesperson for group's military wing said.

link

'Israel's stupidity' is responsible for rockets specifically targeting civilians...zionists. Can't argue with that logic.

 

[WildCat]

'Israel's stupidity' is responsible for rockets specifically targeting civilians...zionists. Can't argue with that logic.

Makes perfect sense to Tin Foil Timothy, The Fool, and the rest of the Hamas apologists.

 

[webfusion]

makes me sad

Me too.
I hesitated about even starting this thread -- I've been conspicuously absent from JREF for a while, avoiding joining topics about this conflict. It was all just getting to be too intense, talking about these same things, over and over.

But today, a full-scale artillery terror barrage against non-military "targets" --- why?
What are they possibly hoping to achieve? This is nuts.


An Israel Air Force strike has killed a Hamas gunman in the southern Gaza Strip after Palestinian militants fired dozens of rockets and mortars into southern Israel on Wednesday.

 

[gdnp]

If that is not a war I dunno what is.

Yep, now it's war. Did you expect Hamas to just roll over and concede?

Amazing how Hamas has all this money for rocket fuel, explosives, and materials to wage war.... but none for food.

Not much good buying food if it rots at the border crossings because Israel won't let it in.

Right now, any Israeli response will be depicted in first page headlines as a desecration of Christmas (destroying the season of Peace, an insult to Christianity, and ruining Hope for the Children of the World), and decried as unfair 'collective punishment' of the poor Palestinians... along with other grotesquely cynical clichés.

Uh...maybe in the Arab press. I suspect that in the US it will be reported as a necessary response to Hamas aggression. Unless, of course, Israel's response is seen as excessive. Thus far I have not seen reports of injuries or deaths. Thus retaliation in highly populated areas in Gaza causing many civilian deaths might be seen as an inappropriate escallation. I believe Israel has the right to use all necessary force to make the shelling stop.

Well I look at it this way. Hamas is shelling civilians on purpose, not Israeli military positions. So in my book that is an act of war. My mother is a tourist in Ashkelon, she has no reason to be shelled because of Hamas's jihad with Israel.

Are you suggesting that Hamas attacking Israeli military positions would not be an act of war?

BTW, a blockade is also considered an act of war. Just saying.