Cont: [ED] Discussion: Trans Women are not Women (Part 5)

[Emily's Cat]

Seems they'll have to try a different loophole, this one didn't work.

For someone who complains about nutpicking... you sure do a lot of it.

Seriously, every time there is a discussion about the actual for-real bad behavior that females are subjected to as a direct result of self-id and the treatment of all transwomen as women... you dismiss it. You just flat out reject them and pretend they don't exist or don't matter.

Yaniv, exploiting the exact same loopholes that we've been complaining about, demonstrating a direct conflict between women's rights and trans rights? Oh, just a vexatious litigant, nothing to see here.

Karen White exploiting the exact same loopholes that we've been complaining about, demonstrating a direct and actual harm to women? Nothing to see here, just a sex predatory, nothing to do with them being trans.

Tyler Porter boasts about harassing women in a crisis shelter, and posts pics online of himself with an erection in the ladies room? Oh, he's just a bad actor, he's not exploiting the giant gaping loophole we've been complaining about.

Christopher Hambrook pretends to be trans to gain access to a shelter, where he sexually harassed the women there and was found masturbating over a sleeping woman? Oh no, there's no risk, he's just a bad person.

~~~ Wait a few days ~~~

All of you females complaining about a giant gaping loophole that will allow malicious males to harm women are just hysterical and paranoid.

Rinse and repeat.

 

[Manger Douse]

That really didn't clarify things at all.

Vaniv had the support of a large group of people who regularly make death and rape threats against those they see as TERFS. Most vexatious litigants don't have that as far as I'm aware

 

[TurkeysGhost]

For someone who complains about nutpicking... you sure do a lot of it.

Seriously, every time there is a discussion about the actual for-real bad behavior that females are subjected to as a direct result of self-id and the treatment of all transwomen as women... you dismiss it. You just flat out reject them and pretend they don't exist or don't matter.

Yaniv, exploiting the exact same loopholes that we've been complaining about, demonstrating a direct conflict between women's rights and trans rights? Oh, just a vexatious litigant, nothing to see here.

Karen White exploiting the exact same loopholes that we've been complaining about, demonstrating a direct and actual harm to women? Nothing to see here, just a sex predatory, nothing to do with them being trans.

Tyler Porter boasts about harassing women in a crisis shelter, and posts pics online of himself with an erection in the ladies room? Oh, he's just a bad actor, he's not exploiting the giant gaping loophole we've been complaining about.

Christopher Hambrook pretends to be trans to gain access to a shelter, where he sexually harassed the women there and was found masturbating over a sleeping woman? Oh no, there's no risk, he's just a bad person.

~~~ Wait a few days ~~~

All of you females complaining about a giant gaping loophole that will allow malicious males to harm women are just hysterical and paranoid.

Rinse and repeat.

Get enough of those anecdotes together and we got a stew going.

 

[TurkeysGhost]

Vaniv had the support of a large group of people who regularly make death and rape threats against those they see as TERFS. Most vexatious litigants don't have that as far as I'm aware

SovCits regularly murder people. A bunch of MAGA CHUDs believed in vexatious election lawsuits enough to invade the Capitol building when the lawsuits failed.

Many vexatious litigants have weirdo fanbases.

 

[Manger Douse]

Canada has self-ID now, and has for a couple years. It requires filling out some forms and having official IDs changed.

So far seems to be fine. no waves of cis-men lining up to get their peeping-tom permit from the gov. I guess we're all waiting for the pervert apocalypse that was promised by the anti-trans advocates when this was being debated years ago.

Three businesses going under doesn't exactly strike me as fine

 

[Emily's Cat]

Is there any reason to believe Yaniv's trans status is insincere?

Does it ******* matter?

Yaniv's trans status is completely ******* irrelevant to the fact that a malicious, predacious, pedophiliac penis-bearer now has LEGAL ******* RIGHT to go into changing rooms with young girls and leer at them while they're naked, as well as exposing himself to them AND THERE'S NOTHING THEY CAN ******* DO ABOUT IT!

 

[TurkeysGhost]

Does it ******* matter?

Yaniv's trans status is completely ******* irrelevant to the fact that a malicious, predacious, pedophiliac penis-bearer now has LEGAL ******* RIGHT to go into changing rooms with young girls and leer at them while they're naked, as well as exposing himself to them AND THERE'S NOTHING THEY CAN ******* DO ABOUT IT!

It matters in the sense that people here are insisting on deadnaming and misgendering her.

Whether or not she's a piece of **** and a nuisance to her community is immaterial to whether or not openly bigoted treatment is acceptable. You don't, in fact, get a transphobe pass just because the target is a real *******.

 

[Earthborn]

Mammalian females bear the brunt of reproductive costs - and will continue to do so. That you are against ANY female-based rights suggests a profound lack of appreciation/ understanding for the underlying biology (and/or misogyny, of course).

That you equate restroom access with access to reproductive healthcare shows a profound lack of appreciation for the difference between "sex based rights" and rights based on medical need. I am very much in favour of the latter.

Arguably worse, it suggests that you value the feelings of a very small number of people over the safety of ~50% of the population.

The needs of the many do not always outweigh the needs of the few. Sometimes both need to be accomodated, and trying to pit them against eachother through segregationist policies is wrong.

 

[Emily's Cat]

Jessica Yaniv is a piece of **** and she just seems to be a professional provocateur and troll, but she is a woman and should not be misgendered just because you don't like her.

She also doesn't represent all trans women, as much as the transphobes here like to use women like her or Karen White to smear the rest of us. Believe me, I wish she wasn't doing what she's been doing either, but you can't use a few bad people to try to denigrate the rest of us just like you can't any other minority.

Nobody is denigrating YOU, nobody is even denigrating transgender people as a whole.

What we are doing is pointing out that the POLICY being pushed by the trans agenda puts FEMALES in danger and reduces our rights and safety because it has a GIANT GAPING LOOPHOLE.

Give me a solid proposal for closing that loophole, and we can start to make progress.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Well we're stuck.

The question is the definition of "woman" and one said has declared not just asking the question but even talking about the possibility of there being a question as a personal attack.

 

[Emily's Cat]

Boudicca isn't even demanding the end of the segregation. She is just demanding access based on what she most resembles, like a light-skinned person wanting access to the "white" restroom, or a dark-skinned person wanting access to the "colored" restroom. Not a very radical demand, IMHO.

She want the RIGHT for penis-havers to be in female spaces, female prisons, play in female sports, get female scholarsips and honors, count as females in politics and executive positions... and to force females to be silent and surrender those things to penis-havers.

The justification for such silencing is that transwomen are "women" in some indefinable way that has nothing at all to do with sex.

And all of this is done while completely ignoring the effect these policies have on females, and casting females as hysterical and paranoid for recognizing the giant gaping loophole in this approach.

 

[Emily's Cat]

No, I insulted sportswomen who use transphobia as an excuse to why they lost their competitions.

Presumably because biology doesn't exist and sex is a social construct, and those females just need to work harder to keep up with a male competitor

 

[Manger Douse]

SovCits regularly murder people. A bunch of MAGA CHUDs believed in vexatious election lawsuits enough to invade the Capitol building when the lawsuits failed.

Many vexatious litigants have weirdo fanbases.

I'm not sure the fact that Donald Trump can rile up a mob too is a great comfort to the women in this case

 

[Emily's Cat]

Transphobia isn't why male athletes have anatomical advantages over female athletes even after hormone therapy.

Biology is transphobic, we need to burn those books and write new ones that don't allow reality to get in the way of ideology.

 

[caveman1917]

Mostly because I don't see any reputable reporting on the matter, just the usual reactionary doom-saying running stories with very little info beyond "let's all gawk at this weirdo".

I found damion's link to be neither reactionary doom-saying running stories nor "let's all gawk at this weirdo." It's where I got the policy that's being challenged and the arguments being made.

I'm not seeing any real legal analysis to indicate whether or not she will be successful, and given her history of meritless lawsuits, I see no reason to care unless she wins.

What a strange position.

 

[TurkeysGhost]

I found damion's link to be neither reactionary doom-saying running stories nor "let's all gawk at this weirdo." It's where I got the policy that's being challenged and the arguments being made.



What a strange position.

Why is that?

There's nothing magical about court filings. Someone making a strange claim in a legal filing is no more interesting to me than someone making a strange claim on a street corner.

Unless the court agrees and rules in favor of Yaniv, whatever she's on about is just ravings of someone known to bring meritless claims.

Our legal system states that the court has to treat all claims seriously and explore their worth, but I don't see why the general public should do so. Especially when we know the person making the claim has a prior history of making bizarre, meritless arguments.

 

[Emily's Cat]

It's absolutely transphobic and congratulations for passing down prejudice to the next generation! Bravo!

Seriously, do you think that sexual predators don't exist? Or that sexual predators are simply way too nice to take advantage of the giant gaping loopholes introduced by self-id in order to engage in predatory behavior?

On a very, very serious note: Why do you hold the feeling of affirmation of transwomen to be a higher priority than the safety of females?

 

[Emily's Cat]

Sure, Yaniv is a legal bully and some of likely a predatory threat to her community. Her being trans is incidental to that, and there are no shortage of similar threats that aren't trans.

You're right - there's no shortage of similar threats that aren't trans. Do you know what 98% of those threats have in common? Go ahead, give it a guess.

 

[Emily's Cat]

As a person who is in favour of equal rights, I am glad that such an abhorrent concept is not actually implemented where I live.

Where is this magical utopian land in which you live? All of the places on earth that I'm aware of still have sexism and racism in their cultures.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Everyone just learn how to hold it in and go to the bathroom at home.

I'm (obviously) being facititious but Jesus people care a lot about what's going on in their bathrooms. Public bathrooms are in, do business, get out. I don't really hang around in them long enough to make other people uncomfortable, get uncomfortable myself.